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Beowulf
05-31-2007, 07:57 AM
so right now im 210, i need to lose 20 pounds and 8% body fat by july (yeah i know im a fatass, havent been able to work out in over a year)

but yeah, basicly ive been running about a mile, 4 miles on an exercising bike, and spend about 30 minutes in a steam room everyday, i dont usually eat breakfast, and eat a peice of fruit/yogurt and some sort of salad or vege soup for breakfast and generally chicken (not friend) for dinner,

just wondering if theres any suggestions about what i should add/drop of what im doing

adonis
05-31-2007, 03:27 PM
eat 5-7 small meals a day, take a daily vitamin.

How tall/old are you?

Diet:
-increase meal frequency

-decrease portion sizes so that no food items are touching or mixed when plated. Ie. If your having spaghetti and a salad. Don't let either food item touch on your plate. Keep a nice clean "seperator/wall" between the foods. It's an easy way to decrease portion size.

-have vegetables/fruit with every meal/snack

-drink only non-calorie containing beverages. ie. tea, coffee, crystal lite, water.

-have a complete protien source with each meal. Ie. chciken, fish, beef, milk, quiona

-eat mostly whole foods. Not packaged, homemade meals. Something Mom would eat.

-Save "other" carbs like sugar for the postworkout period if needed.


Cardio:
-Try doing 3-5 HIIT workouts per week. Essentialy just interval training. I like; 60's sprint/60's recovery/8-10 sets. Or 20's sprint/10's recovery/8-10 sets. Or Incline hill runnning. Or 400meter sprints.

-Try doing only 1-2(if you have less than 15% BF you could do 3 sessions) steady state cardio workouts each week. 30-40 minutes at a hamster pace.

-Increase NEPA; non-exercise physical activity. By walking to work, taking the stairs, standing vs sitting, holding abdominals isometrically contracted...


Weight training:

-you need to preserve muscel mass so 2-3 total body weight training workouts would be advised. I like to use 5sets of 5reps @ 40secRi on day 1. 4 sets of 8-10reps on day 2, and a "complexes" type of workout for day 3.
Remeber a TB workout includes: 1 compound leg mov't, 1 compound upper push mov't, 1 upper compound pull mov't and some other stuff like abs.

ie:
Day 1 5x5 @ 40sec Ri
A: Barbell front squat
B: Barbell push-press
C: 1/4 bent over barbell row
D: Single leg dumbbell deadlift
E: Chins x max reps
F: Incline dumbbell bench press
G: Dumbbell external rotations x 10-12reps
H: An abs mov't

Beowulf
05-31-2007, 10:21 PM
im 20 and im 6'1

the only problem with eating small meals and spending a while working out, is i work 5am - 2:30 pm 5 days a week, and my wife generally works from 5 or 6pm to like 12. so like 5 days a week i get to spend about 90 min in the gym and 2 days a week i go twice each for about 2 hours

the reason im doing this is i need to by the end of july to leave for bootcamp for the navy

like for instance today, woke up at 10:30, ate a nutri grain bar, drunk a glass of green tea, went to the gym, rode a bike for 4 miles, did some bicep and chest workouts, 200 crunches, spent 15 minutes in the sauna, ran 1.5 miles, spent 15 minutes in the steam room, then played basketball for a bit, came home, ate a bowl of special k cereal with a banana, then im planning on going back to do the same thing and eat a chicken salad tonight, the only things im drinking are water, vitamin water, green tea, and hawiiaan punch

on a side note, whats the difference bewteen a sauna and steam room, i mean i know how theyre different but which should i spend more time in

Rufio
05-31-2007, 11:39 PM
I wouldn't do cardio and lifting on the same day. Additionally, instead of a nutri-grain bar you should grain some Met-Rx Protein Plus bars from CVS. Those can be decent meal replacements for while you're at work. There's also Myoplex drink 4-packs you can get at Publix which are also great meal replacements.

Beowulf
06-01-2007, 12:52 AM
well im mainly just trying to lose weight so i do cardio everyday, all i do really are curls, shoulder press, and bench press, should i drop lifting?

and thanks about the tip for bars and myoplex, i actually work at publix so it will be easy

Rufio
06-01-2007, 01:07 AM
A Myoplex 4-pack is about $12, so it can be pricey, but it's no worse than a Subway sub.


Anyway, lifting can help because muscle speeds up your metabolism, BUT the thing is that to build muscle you need a caloric surplus (taking in more calories than you expend) the day you lift and it helps to keep a caloric surplus the day after. It's kind of a paradox. To build muscle you need a TON of calories which makes cardio counter-productive, but once the muscle's there, it speeds up your metabolism and helps you acheive calorie deficits, thus fat loss, more often.


Do what Adonis said, HIIT. I just started it and I'm seeing continued results but without muscle loss.

adonis
06-01-2007, 05:38 AM
Those workouts should take no longer than an hour. If you need to do less exercises per session

Beowulf
06-01-2007, 06:00 AM
Cardio:
-Try doing 3-5 HIIT workouts per week. Essentialy just interval training. I like; 60's sprint/60's recovery/8-10 sets. Or 20's sprint/10's recovery/8-10 sets. Or Incline hill runnning. Or 400meter sprints.

sorry man just dont know what you mean by 60's sprint/60's recovery

Rufio
06-01-2007, 06:24 AM
He means 1 minute of running really fast and one minute of jogging or fast walking to "recover" from the sprint portion. Y'know, "intervals" of intense running and slower cardio for recovery from the intense portion. The goal of HIIT is to shock your metabolism with these intervals that leap back and forth in intensity.

Beowulf
06-01-2007, 06:30 AM
alright thanks man, i appreciate it,

are a sauna and steam room basicly the same? the gym i go to has both but dont they do pretty much the same thing

Rufio
06-01-2007, 06:37 AM
Why would you want to use one of those? As far as I know cutting water weight doesn't help with reducing body fat.

Beowulf
06-01-2007, 07:19 AM
thats what i thought as well, but my cheir said all he does before he has to weigh in is go to the steam room everyday for about a weekand told me to do the same :/

Rufio
06-01-2007, 07:39 AM
Well yeah, before you WEIGH IN for a fight. That's because you want to be bigger than the other people in your weight class, so you drop water weight to make it to a lower weight class, then refuel overnight and on fight day you weight more than a guy who's competing at his natural weight. That's entirely different than training to lose fat.

jwynne_4
06-01-2007, 07:52 AM
I'm looking to lose some weight myself by July.(going to a wedding and seeing people I haven't seen sense college and highschool) and in general, mainly because I have let myself go the last few years sense I had quit playing baseball in college because of two major shoulder surgries with in two yrs. Anyway I'm already doing alot of the lifting, dieting and HIIT cardio you guys are recommending. But why not lift and do cardio on the sameday? One reason I ask is because the trainer at my gym told me he wants me to at least an hr of cardio a day, but at this point there is no chance I can my HIIT cardio for hr, but days I lift legs I generaly ride the bike for about an hr.

adonis
06-01-2007, 01:46 PM
Actually the RECOVERY means, no work. Jump off to the side supports of the tredmill, and rest.

You can also do intervals of 60s sprint/60s jog/8-10 sets but it is not as hard and takes longer.

adonis
06-01-2007, 01:48 PM
I'm looking to lose some weight myself by July.(going to a wedding and seeing people I haven't seen sense college and highschool) and in general, mainly because I have let myself go the last few years sense I had quit playing baseball in college because of two major shoulder surgries with in two yrs. Anyway I'm already doing alot of the lifting, dieting and HIIT cardio you guys are recommending. But why not lift and do cardio on the sameday? One reason I ask is because the trainer at my gym told me he wants me to at least an hr of cardio a day, but at this point there is no chance I can my HIIT cardio for hr, but days I lift legs I generaly ride the bike for about an hr.


Come see me at my gym. I'll set you straight.

(Seriously if your in Toronto, come on down to the gym. I'll help you out.)

Beowulf
06-02-2007, 02:19 AM
Well yeah, before you WEIGH IN for a fight. That's because you want to be bigger than the other people in your weight class, so you drop water weight to make it to a lower weight class, then refuel overnight and on fight day you weight more than a guy who's competing at his natural weight. That's entirely different than training to lose fat.
im talking about for the navy, when he has to weigh in to make sure hes not overweight he goes to the sauna everyday for like a week

jwynne_4
06-02-2007, 03:28 AM
Come see me at my gym. I'll set you straight.

(Seriously if your in Toronto, come on down to the gym. I'll help you out.)

Man if i was in Toronto I'd love to come see you, I like reading the advice you give people but I'm in Arizona. But ya man keep posting your advice and I'll follow it the best I can. But still why not lift and do cardio on the same day? Still a little confused about that

adonis
06-02-2007, 04:38 AM
im talking about for the navy, when he has to weigh in to make sure hes not overweight he goes to the sauna everyday for like a week
Same thing though, too loose water weight, and not bodyfat. We hold a large amount fo water in our bodies, and depelting it will lead to a dramatic weight loss. But bodyfat numbers would stay the same.

adonis
06-02-2007, 04:39 AM
Man if i was in Toronto I'd love to come see you, I like reading the advice you give people but I'm in Arizona. But ya man keep posting your advice and I'll follow it the best I can. But still why not lift and do cardio on the same day? Still a little confused about that


You could do both on the same day. But by splitting them up, you will be training more frequently. The frequency willl keep the metabolic furnace burning and you'll ahve aan elevated metabolism 24/7.

FDVToad
06-02-2007, 06:03 AM
Hi guys, great information, but I was wondering where you would throw body weight/calisthenics in there?

I don't have access to a gym, so I'm stuck with the poor man's set up: pull up / dip station, some free weights and a deck of cards. Now, what I am doing at this point is warming up with about 150 jumping jacks (working my up to 500+...like Sensei John....) going to failure on pushup variations, dips, squats, burpees, etc. every other day. I've just started doing this about a week and a half ago, after a long hiatus, and my goal is to be able to go longer everyday...I am also going to start doing Arnis stick work everyday. I'm eventually going to work in the HIITs.

Diet wise...well...I guess at this point in my life style with work and the whole nine, any day without junk food is a good day...small multiple meals seem like a million miles away right now...

My goals are about the same as thread starter, so aside from improving diet, is their any other additions I can make (besides someone to light a fire under my ass everyday)?

jwynne_4
06-02-2007, 12:20 PM
You could do both on the same day. But by splitting them up, you will be training more frequently. The frequency willl keep the metabolic furnace burning and you'll ahve aan elevated metabolism 24/7.

Well ya I can uderstand that. I'm working out 5-7 days a week anyway usually 6 . It's been about a month and half sense i starred working out again, I'm really starting to get into it again. But through out highschool and college it was always a 24-7 job. With football in the fall, wrestling in winter and baseball in the spring and summer. lifted and did my cardio sameday. especially with football and wrestling. I'm 6'0 2605bs now, But i can say the best shape I was ever in I weighed about 195-205 with about 8-10 percent body fat my senior of highschool, I'm a stocky build. I'd like to get back to around 200-215 with in the next yr. But for vain reasons I'd like to get as low as I can in the next month.

jwynne_4
06-02-2007, 12:37 PM
I have another question, I have been getting bad muscle fatigue all week. What would be the main reason besides overtraining. Because I'm going lighter, I'm just getting back into it. A friend of mine said I might be eating to little espeically carbs after work outs. But I'm trying to make sure I'm getting all my carbs and sugers post workout. I'm eatomg about 6-8 times a day alot of protien chicken, red meat plus I love fish, But I can't figure it out. He suggested a multi vitaim which I'm starting to take. But what else can I do?

adonis
06-02-2007, 04:48 PM
I have another question, I have been getting bad muscle fatigue all week. What would be the main reason besides overtraining. Because I'm going lighter, I'm just getting back into it. A friend of mine said I might be eating to little espeically carbs after work outs. But I'm trying to make sure I'm getting all my carbs and sugers post workout. I'm eatomg about 6-8 times a day alot of protien chicken, red meat plus I love fish, But I can't figure it out. He suggested a multi vitaim which I'm starting to take. But what else can I do?


Try some carbs pre-workout.

Beowulf
06-03-2007, 01:52 AM
about the protein bars/drinks, i was under the impression you want a lot of protein when youre trying to build a lot of muscle, i am mainly just trying to tone up my upper body, and i eat chicken at least once a day

and i work out 6 days a week, if its my day off of work i go twice so i do cardio in the morning and lift later, its that ok?

adonis
06-03-2007, 02:34 AM
about the protein bars/drinks, i was under the impression you want a lot of protein when youre trying to build a lot of muscle, i am mainly just trying to tone up my upper body, and i eat chicken at least once a day

and i work out 6 days a week, if its my day off of work i go twice so i do cardio in the morning and lift later, its that ok?

Sure. But try and get a nap between the training sessions. Wait around 4 hours (but no longer than 6hrs) and eat! Post training nutrition will be important.

Beowulf
06-03-2007, 02:47 AM
what about the protein though? since im not really doing any heavy lifting do i need that much

Rufio
06-03-2007, 03:32 AM
Cardio in the morning then lifting later in the day is fine. What's a waste of time IMO is doing them at the same time or doing cardio later in the day after you lifted. In order to build ANY muscle, you have to take in more calories than you expend in your workout. To burn fat, you have to use up more calories throughout the day than you take in. Personally, I seem to have MUCH faster results when I split the days, especially since you need to eat a lot more when you're trying to build muscle than when your aim is to burn fat.

adonis
06-03-2007, 09:13 PM
You should still be getting 30-40% of your total caloric intake in the form of protein. Regardless of bulking or deiting.

Tick
06-05-2007, 09:08 PM
From what I understand (and someone can correct me if I am wrong) protein helps your muscles heal, help you feal more full, and actually assist in the burning of calories. When doing your calorie intake for a day remember that 1 gram of protein and Carbs are 4 calories, Fat is 9 calories, and Alcohol is 7 (These numbers look right, but again correct me if I am wrong).

Protein helps you lose weight because it is good calories coming into your system. Protein is good :-)

I have used the HIIT before. That stuff gives you a killer workout. I dropped from 220 pounds to about 190 in 3 to 4 months. I did HIIT cardio workout and I formulated my weight workouts to be kind of like cardio. It was a circuit training workout where I took little to no rest between the differnt excercises. Took about a minute or two rest between circuits though.

From things I have read Squats and like excercises help burn tons of calories. This is because they work the iggest muscle group in the body, the legs. I dont recall the exact numbers but for every pound of lean muscle mass, you burn X (300?) more calories a day by doing nothing.

adonis
06-05-2007, 10:15 PM
From what I understand (and someone can correct me if I am wrong) protein helps your muscles heal, help you feal more full, and actually assist in the burning of calories. When doing your calorie intake for a day remember that 1 gram of protein and Carbs are 4 calories, Fat is 9 calories, and Alcohol is 7 (These numbers look right, but again correct me if I am wrong).

Protein helps you lose weight because it is good calories coming into your system. Protein is good :-)

I have used the HIIT before. That stuff gives you a killer workout. I dropped from 220 pounds to about 190 in 3 to 4 months. I did HIIT cardio workout and I formulated my weight workouts to be kind of like cardio. It was a circuit training workout where I took little to no rest between the differnt excercises. Took about a minute or two rest between circuits though.

From things I have read Squats and like excercises help burn tons of calories. This is because they work the iggest muscle group in the body, the legs. I dont recall the exact numbers but for every pound of lean muscle mass, you burn X (300?) more calories a day by doing nothing.

First off, you read too much "stuff" but aren't learning any concepts behind what you read.


The role of protein

As a major functional and structural component of all cells in your body, protein is the most important building material for muscles, hormones, enzymes and the immune system.

Proteins are formed from building blocks known as ‘amino acids’. All the body’s proteins are made up from various combinations of the same twenty different amino acids. Of the twenty amino acids, eight cannot be made in the body and have to be ingested with your food. These are valine, leucine, isoleucine, threonine, methionine, phenylalanine, tryptophane and lysine. These are known as the essential amino acids and you should ensure that you are consuming the recommended daily allowance of all eight of these amino acids. As a sports participant, the essential amino acids valine, leucine, and isoleucine are of particular importance as these are used when your body uses protein as an energy source.


The reason protein is good on a diet is it has a thermogenic effect.

In a study published in the American Journal of Physiology, one group was fed a high protein diet (just over one gram per pound of bodyweight per day) while the second group consumed a protein diet near equal to that of the RDA.

The group eating the high protein diet burned more fat than the group consuming protein near equal to the RDA.One reason for this could be an increased "thermic" effect. The thermic effect of the RDA group was elevated 16% after eating.

However, in the high protein group the thermic effect increased 42% after eating, almost 3 times that of the RDA group.

This thermic effect of digesting your food peaks approximately one hour after eating. Spreading your daily caloric intake over 6 meals a day, eating every 2 to 3 hours, helps to take advantage of the increased metabolic rate that accompanies eating.

In other words, the more often you eat, the higher your metabolic rate, i.e. the number of calories your body burns each day.

In addition, by adding more protein to each meal, you also increase your metabolism. Your body requires more energy (i.e. calories) to process protein than it does to digest carbohydrates.

Tick
06-06-2007, 06:07 PM
Thanks for the information, it is very good.