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View Full Version : New England CHEATING.



Noise Chopped
09-13-2007, 10:16 AM
Ok, so it's pretty obvious now that the NFL has determined the New England patriots were caught on tape, so to speak. I can't be the only person who thinks they should forfeit that game against the Jets, am I? ESPN is talking about draft picks and shit - Fuck that, make'em forfeit the game they cheated in!

Dork8503
09-13-2007, 10:35 AM
Why take it out on the players then odds are they had nothing to do with it.

I would suspend the coach or fine him or whatever, but to take it out on the players is bullshit.

Noise Chopped
09-13-2007, 10:54 AM
Well, if the players are upset about the cheating their coaches did - Who should they get upset with? They've no one to blame but the coaches (if they had nothing to do with it).

This isn't even a case of it POSSIBLY being cheating, or rumours about, or speculation of, circumstantial evidence with - PFFT. This is cheating. Draft picks? Granted it's not the worst of the worst when it comes to cheating - And the Patriots probably aren't the first or last to do it, but they got caught! One game. Just the game they cheated in, no more no less.

But draft picks and a fine...Just getting off easy, if you ask me. Forfeit the one game, and move on.

TheBonger
09-13-2007, 10:57 AM
i say ban them from the league and replace them with the Toronto Argonauts!

Noise Chopped
09-13-2007, 11:22 AM
i say ban them from the league and replace them with the Toronto Argonauts!

Hahahah, now THAT would be fucking awesome. Honestly - Even if they were the worst team the-fuck ever. I've been hearing that name tossed around almost every time a player thinks up a new place to call home. A high Ricky Williams? T-T-T-T-T-T-TANK Johnson? Hell yea.

...What in the world's an ARGONAUT? OH, WHO CARES. COULD BE WHAT GNOMES POO, OR GARGOYLES PEE. Either way, I'm for THIS plan.

Daver46
09-13-2007, 11:44 AM
Yea seems pointless to take away draft picks only hurts players. Not the team. Big fine & Suspend the coach for a few games.

eazye76
09-13-2007, 03:00 PM
Wasn't Nick Saban busted for doing something sort of like this last year against the Patriots. I remember he did something involving "stealing" Brady's audibles, can't remember exactly, some people were pissed but nothing ever happened.

Mac
09-13-2007, 04:56 PM
Suspend Billicheck for 4 games and take away a 1st round draft pick. They could even make them forfiet the game on top of that. They need to make a serious statement out of this so that teams feel the price of getting caught is not worth taking the chance.

jesusatemyhotdog
09-13-2007, 05:02 PM
I find this bizarre, because we are talking about defensive signals, which are done out in the open. If the NFL wants to stop this from happening, give the DC a headset linked to the defensive captain that calls plays.

Problem solved.

kickass32
09-13-2007, 05:43 PM
Can someone elaborate on this...what did they do??

Clint
09-13-2007, 06:14 PM
They had a guy on the sideline videotaping the other team's hand signals from the defense coach to the players.

Presumably they were then using it to figure out what play would be coming next. Since that would take some time it wouldn't help them during this game but next time they played, New England would know what the defense was going to do each play.

Also who knows how long theyve been doing this

eazye76
09-13-2007, 06:38 PM
I really don't think this is a very big deal. Stealing signals IS NOT against the rules. The rule they broke was using electronic equipment to steal signs. This has happened before w/ the Dodgers and Giants, and also more recently with Ozzie Guillen(White Sox) accused some other team of mounting a camera in the scoreboard to record signals.
Also I think it's important to note that ex-players in the media not only think it's no big deal, but also state that everybody does this. The only reason the Pats got caught was b/c The Jets orginization(Mangini) had inside information, and knew what to look for. This issue also surfaced in a Green Bay game last year and nobody even reported it. The reason this Pats/Jets thing is such huge news is b/c of the Pats/Jets, Belichick/Mangini, Boston/NY issues, and the fact that the NY media is involved.
Also, the outcome of the game should not be changed. The Jets got their ass kicked. The Pats wern't stealing offensive signals, and Pennington/Clemmons could do nothing. Ellis Hobbs got them 7 pts on Special Teams, and Moss simply torched the Jets secondary. The Detroit Lions have been strongly accused of doing this stuff in the past, how has it worked out for them?
The Pats are fucking loaded, and are the best team in the league - with or without video equipment.

Metalhead
09-13-2007, 09:42 PM
I'd say it's rediculous that this is a big deal. Stealling signals isnt' really going to help you win games, by the time you figure out what the other coach called the play will be on.

TravelinMonty
09-13-2007, 09:52 PM
1. they should definitely forfeit the game to the jets
2. they should be stripped of the Lombardis
3. Belichick should be banned from the NFL because he is a cheater and he has eaten his own children(at least according to one unverified report on wikipedia)

Either that or Belichick should have to be the Jets' waterboy.

Dan0
09-14-2007, 07:59 PM
Come On. Do yall think that this hasn't gone on for a long long time. I remember George Allen sending a guy to Dallas to spy Tom Landry and the DaBoys from a hotel room across the street from the DaBoys training facility. This type of stuff is gone on for a looooooooooooong time.

(Man am I showing my age)

TheBonger
09-14-2007, 10:00 PM
Come On. Do yall think that this hasn't gone on for a long long time. I remember George Allen sending a guy to Dallas to spy Tom Landry and the DaBoys from a hotel room across the street from the DaBoys training facility. This type of stuff is gone on for a looooooooooooong time.

(Man am I showing my age)

murder,rape,prostituion all have been around for a LONG LONG time, does that make them any less wrong?

eazye76
09-15-2007, 12:21 AM
murder,rape,prostituion all have been around for a LONG LONG time, does that make them any less wrong?
It doesn't make it right, but if it's been going on for a long time, it's obviously acceptable by society's standard.
Also murder and rape are light years away from "cheating" in a football game. A better analogy would be Sammy Sosa's corked bat, or George Brett's pine tar incident, both of which were punished by the league.

TheBonger
09-15-2007, 01:02 AM
It doesn't make it right, but if it's been going on for a long time, it's obviously acceptable by society's standard.
Also murder and rape are light years away from "cheating" in a football game. A better analogy would be Sammy Sosa's corked bat, or George Brett's pine tar incident, both of which were punished by the league.


no they wouldnt make for a better analogy because my point has nothing to do with comparing rape and murder too cheating in a football. What it does have something to do with is the fact that just because something has been going for a long time does not mean it is not wrong or unacceptable. Murder and Rape have been happening for a long time and are definitely not acceptable. Cheating has been happening for a long time and is definitely not acceptable.


Also your first line is complete rubbish, just because something has been going on a long time does not make it acceptable by society's standard. Lets think before we type.

Severn
09-15-2007, 04:39 AM
Media makes things a lot worse than what they are. I don't see fans foaming at the mouth about this. In the end you still have to play the game. This is what I call the "sports balance". Baseball steals signs like crazy and not much happens yet they are the hit hard when it comes to steroids (even tho' track and field is way dirtier).

Football goes overboard with the signal stealing yet steroids is brushed aside. Shawne Merriman gets busted and suspended for steroids in 2006 yet still plays in the 2006 playoffs and pro-bowl.

It's all bullshit.

pa99fighter
09-15-2007, 04:53 AM
they should have forfeited the win b/c the only reason they won it is b/c they picked apart the jets defense and now we know why. im not sayin they cant beat the jets but they cheated

eazye76
09-17-2007, 03:58 PM
NE just beat the total shit out of the 2nd or 3rd best team in the league last night and I think we can all agree there was no videotaping going on. Did Adalius Thomas use video to return that interception, was the secondary cheating when they dominated, did the camera put Jamal Williams out of the game? Everybody is just piling on NE because they are obviously the best team in the NFL.
Video taping is illegal in the NFL and so is holding. NE got away w/ video taping, teams get away with holding all the time.
After watching the Pats and the Chargers yesterday does anyone really think the Jets had any chance when they played each other. Giving that win to NY would be a hell of a lot more of a shift of competitive balance than the video thing.

I would also like to apologize to thebonger b/c his sense of morality is much higher than my own. lol

Dan0
09-17-2007, 08:30 PM
no they wouldnt make for a better analogy because my point has nothing to do with comparing rape and murder too cheating in a football. What it does have something to do with is the fact that just because something has been going for a long time does not mean it is not wrong or unacceptable. Murder and Rape have been happening for a long time and are definitely not acceptable. Cheating has been happening for a long time and is definitely not acceptable.


Also your first line is complete rubbish, just because something has been going on a long time does not make it acceptable by society's standard. Lets think before we type.
Yea, they keep saying pot possession is wrong.

eazye76
09-18-2007, 12:08 AM
Yea, they keep saying pot possession is wrong.
Right on, smoking pot and cheating in football should not get you a one way ticket to hell.:grinsmile26:

Spain215
09-18-2007, 04:13 AM
of all the teams to do this to...the jets? come on. well maybe this is why they have been so succesful in recent years.

Severn
09-18-2007, 05:24 AM
of all the teams to do this to...the jets? come on. well maybe this is why they have been so succesful in recent years.

Apparently they have libraries of all teams even the Lions. That and the Jets head coach used to be a coordinator for the Pats so Magene knows some of the Pats secrets as well.

iverbure
09-18-2007, 07:40 AM
I am quickly becoming a Pats fan. I live in Canada so i kinda have the local Buffalo fan thing going on but they have been terrible for soooo long and i see lots of Patriots games, but how can you hate them. They don't have any stars, they just simply "OUT SMART" every team they play against. Stealing signs... excatly why is it against the rules??? Why not let every team do this. The Pats would still win. Remember a couple of years ago when they made rules against the Pats cause Manning looked silly against the Pats defense. Oh yeah that was last year ... than the Colts won. I am not making this stuff up, simply put the Pats are the best team and will remain the best team in the AFC, and as long as they have the bills and the dolphins in their division they'll continue to be in the playoffs.

eazye76
09-18-2007, 04:09 PM
Stealing signs... excatly why is it against the rules??? Why not let every team do this.
Well, stealing signs actually isn't against the rules. It's 100% legal to do it, and a lot of teams(if not all) do it. The rule the Pats broke was using electronic equipment to do it.
That's why I really don't think it's a big deal.

eazye76
09-18-2007, 05:10 PM
Sorry about the double post, I thought this was interesting, but not worth a new thread. Basiclly the Ravens coach accuses Jets coach of "cheating" - good read.

Credit - ProFootballTalk.com

http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm


BILLICK SAYS JETS USED ILLEGAL PLOY by Michael David Smith

Ravens coach Brian Billick is accusing the Jets of using an illegal ploy to draw false start penalties on the Ravens' offensive linemen during Sunday's game.

According to Billick, the Jets' defense shouted out signals to throw off the Baltimore offense, and the result was three illegal procedure penalties against the Ravens.

"They did an outstanding job. I credit the New York Jets. Their defensive line and linebackers did a very, very effective job of illegally simulating the snap count," Billick said. "They did it the whole game long. It needs to be caught."

Billick also seemed to indicate that he believed the officials called too many penalties on his team and not enough on the Jets. The Ravens had 11 penalties for 100 yards and the Jets had two for 20 in the Ravens' 20-13 victory.

"You have to look at the nature of the penalties. First off, the fact that we had 11 penalties and they only had two and we dominated the game," Billick said. "I have a hard time understanding that the team that was playing so well and dominating had so many penalties and the other team had only two."

Billick's complaint against the Jets could represent the coaching fraternity's first piece of retribution against Jets coach Eric Mangini for the role the Jets played in turning in the Patriots for illegally taping the Jets' defensive signals. Billick may want to spread the word that, in his view, Mangini isn't exactly a model coaching citizen, either.