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View Full Version : Who needs the win more...Lesnar or Mir



jrod17
11-11-2007, 04:55 PM
When these two battle at ufc 81(I believe)......is all this Brock Lesnar hype way too much for him or will he shine?

Overall i ask...who needs this win more...Mir because this will probably stop his comeback completely or will Lesnar need this win cuz a lose might hurt his confidence and his presence in the UFC.

Punk Ass
11-11-2007, 08:03 PM
Mir needs it more. Lesnar has plenty of time to prove himself. It will only look very bad for Mir to lose to a guy who had only one MMA fight, and Dana will probably kick him out of the UFC

2mcgrath
11-11-2007, 08:22 PM
tough question,and i could see why each would need the win worse.but i will have to agree with harlem on this one.i think mir will need the win worse here.

Nate_Deezy
11-11-2007, 08:37 PM
If this were just a fight between Mir and another guy who started out in MMA without any prior fame, I would agree with the other posters. However, the stigma that Brock Lesnar carries with him from being a former pro wrestler indicates to me that Brock needs this win MUCH more than Mir. Look around this board, or any MMA board for that matter. These places are about as anti-pro wrestling as you can get. I can hear the backlash now.

"Go back to FAKE wrestling"

"Not so good now that your matches aren't pre-decided, huh?"

"Looks like the roids couldn't help him here"

And so on and so on. Lesnar needs this win to remind all the stupid fucking fans (not the regulars here, moreso the trolls that flood these boards immediately after any given UFC show...well....along with a couple of the regulars too I suppose) that Brock is a NCAA D-1 national heavyweight champion amateur wrestler who compiled an entire college career of 106-5. Now people will say he's not technical, and he's all power. .....And? Hasn't it proven effective for him?

Cardio will be another issue people will bring up, but the fact is he almost made it to the NFL after trying out one year, and having not played football since high school. He wasn't cut, as some people will contend....they just offered him a chance to play in NFL Europe, which would include being away from his family for long periods of time, the exact reason he left pro wrestling. And I'm pretty sure, correct me if I'm wrong, that no NFL team, America or Europe, would offer him a spot on their team unless they were sure he could last for an entire 60 minute football game, which is, in my opinion, as, if not more tiring than any MMA fight not to mention much longer.

Sorry...that's my rant lol.

unquiet
11-11-2007, 08:47 PM
Mir needs the win, Lesner just needs to prove himself. There's a difference between proving yourself and winning. Maybe in fact, Mir needs to prove that he's still fight like a champion. Lesner needs to come out and show that he's a warrior.

I just want a good fight.

Gurry
11-11-2007, 11:49 PM
Mir needs it more. Lesnar has plenty of time to prove himself. It will only look very bad for Mir to lose to a guy who had only one MMA fight, and Dana will probably kick him out of the UFC

i doubt dana will kick mir out if he loses this fight, hes 2-2 in his last four a loss here wuld make him 1-2 in his last 3. I think mir could win this fight, according to imes lesnars jiu-jitsu is terrible and i tihnk if lesnar is dumb enuf to put mir up against the cage, mir culd push off grab an arm and "a la" tim sylvia and bust dudes arm. I dont know well see what happens, i dont think lesnar vs mir is a good fight for lesnars enterance to the ufc, they shulda put him up against antoni hardonk or justin eillers, some can or something. If Mir comes in shape hes an animal.

On the topic of who needs it more, i agree with harlem hustla in that sense, mir needs this win, theres no shame in being 1-0 and losing to frank mir.I think as long as brock bring it and duznt catch a flying triangle in the first few seconds nobody will be disappointed in his performance. Mir has the capabilties to be the top tier fighter he once was, and i really hope he brings it, his career is riding on this and this is more publicity to the casual fan, beating a world famous wrestler will get you known pretty fast. WAR MIR!!!!

Great thread topic btw

FFFRpickup
11-12-2007, 12:54 AM
When these two battle at ufc 81(I believe)......is all this Brock Lesnar hype way too much for him or will he shine?

Overall i ask...who needs this win more...Mir because this will probably stop his comeback completely or will Lesnar need this win cuz a lose might hurt his confidence and his presence in the UFC.

Frank Mir needs the win way more than lesnar.

My breakdown:

Frank loses=He is officially a "has Been" and the accident and broken leg basically ended his career.
Frank wins=Frank beat a household name that is world renound. Will do wonders to Mirs confidence.

Lesnar Wins= He is almost expected to do well against Mir Because both basically have weak standup and both can wrestle.(brock's world wrestling/Mir's world BJJ) If brock wins+ everybody would say..."well ya...he's a world class wrestler"
Lesnar Loses=simply put.."He wasn't ready for a very experienced fighter and ex champ" "Give brock a year or two and look out!

Frank Mir NEEDS this win like the oxygen in his lungs!! Lesnar can loose and still actually become way better in the future!

neonatural45
11-12-2007, 02:20 AM
Indeed a good topic. Nate Deezy makes a point with the wrestling bashing but IMO the WWE stuff he did awhile go is only going to help him in his career. Its not going to make him anything of a better fighter but it will bring in fans for the UFC and pretty much garuntee him making main cards regardless of losses. Mir on the other hand didn't even make the main card at UFC 74 (which was a semi-weak card), I think he needs this more becuase of his age and the rollercoaster that his career has been. If UFC had been as big as it is now when Mir was champ my answer might be different, but Mir isn't a draw and isn't well known to the average fan.... Brock on the other hand is. Kinda sad that someone with one fight is better known then an ex heavyweight champion but thats hype, and thats why Mir needs this fight more.

kingrobert
11-12-2007, 07:28 AM
Mir needs this fight more. Everyone knows that Brock is going to need more time and training before he becomes a force in the UFC. Even if Brock looses he still probably has a couple fights on his contract. Mir losses and im sure he is out of the UFC. I really wish Frank could gain his confidence and become the fighter who made Tim tap. He just looks like he is scared everytime he steps back into the cage.

Brutus
11-12-2007, 11:14 PM
i pretty much agree w/ everyone in saying that Mir needs the win more than Lesnar.

I also think that the UFC needs Lesnar to win more than Brock needs a win in the UFC. Like Harlem said, Lesnar has plenty of time to prove himself and not many would be too shocked if he lost his first fight in the Octagon. If Lesnar wins teh UFC will have one of the biggest hyped fighters in a long time. Just more money to put in Dana and theFertitta's pocket if Brock can win this one.

Steel
11-17-2007, 02:02 PM
If this were just a fight between Mir and another guy who started out in MMA without any prior fame, I would agree with the other posters. However, the stigma that Brock Lesnar carries with him from being a former pro wrestler indicates to me that Brock needs this win MUCH more than Mir. Look around this board, or any MMA board for that matter. These places are about as anti-pro wrestling as you can get. I can hear the backlash now.

"Go back to FAKE wrestling"

"Not so good now that your matches aren't pre-decided, huh?"

"Looks like the roids couldn't help him here"

And so on and so on. Lesnar needs this win to remind all the stupid fucking fans (not the regulars here, moreso the trolls that flood these boards immediately after any given UFC show...well....along with a couple of the regulars too I suppose) that Brock is a NCAA D-1 national heavyweight champion amateur wrestler who compiled an entire college career of 106-5. Now people will say he's not technical, and he's all power. .....And? Hasn't it proven effective for him?

Cardio will be another issue people will bring up, but the fact is he almost made it to the NFL after trying out one year, and having not played football since high school. He wasn't cut, as some people will contend....they just offered him a chance to play in NFL Europe, which would include being away from his family for long periods of time, the exact reason he left pro wrestling. And I'm pretty sure, correct me if I'm wrong, that no NFL team, America or Europe, would offer him a spot on their team unless they were sure he could last for an entire 60 minute football game, which is, in my opinion, as, if not more tiring than any MMA fight not to mention much longer.

Sorry...that's my rant lol.

Agreed. I like Mir but he's close to the edge as it is now anyway. Brock is at the start of a potentially long MMA career. Until he quits and decides he wants to play baseball. (j/k)

Mac
11-17-2007, 10:51 PM
I guess I'll be the lone wolf here. Lesnar deffinately needs this more. He needs to prove he's not just an attraction but a real fighter.

Mir was one of my favorite fighters but at this point he is a gatekeeper at hw. He is never going to see the gold again so a loss here doesn't really do anything to him.

lottie-12
11-18-2007, 01:26 AM
I would like it to be a good fight too. I would like to see Lesner win because if he loses that basically the end of his mma career. And another reason for every one to bash on WWE.:deadhorse:

As for who needs the win both.

Mir- if he loses he's gonna be seen as a joke, & his career too might be over.
Lesner- to show that he's not a joke

Kansas
11-24-2007, 03:08 PM
Mir so needs this more than Lesnar. I don't think you could call this any other way.

If Mir can't win this he is a washed up has been. If Brock loses, he is just getting much neeed octagon experience. This is a horrible match for Mir. If he loses, it will be to a guy who by all rights and means should not have a chance against him, especially since Mir really doesn't give away the size the way many HW fighters will against Lesnar.

For Mir, there are no excuses. If he loses, it is because he sucks. No one will dismiss it for any reason he can come up with. He will have to have a medcally verified stroke during the match for MMA fans to "understand".

Brutus
11-24-2007, 07:11 PM
I would like it to be a good fight too. I would like to see Lesner win because if he loses that basically the end of his mma career. And another reason for every one to bash on WWE.:deadhorse:

As for who needs the win both.

Mir- if he loses he's gonna be seen as a joke, & his career too might be over.
Lesner- to show that he's not a joke

what? i think you just contradicted yourself. you say brocks career will be over? THIS IS HIS 2ND MMA FIGHT EVER!!! His career is just starting win or lose. There is not one org in the world that would deny him a spot on a card because he lost to Frank mir, a former UFC heavyweight champion.


I usually see the logic in most peoples opinion but i just cant seem to find any here. how many fighters do you k know of that stepped into their 2nd mma fight against a former champion? nobody.


EDIT: no one really bashes on the WWE unless they are actually talking about wrestlers who say that MMA is crap, i.e. John Cena. otherwise, the WWE is left to the "Other Sports" section of this forum.

DirtyDirtBiker
11-25-2007, 12:42 AM
It took me a while to think about it, but i think Lesnar needs the win more. I think Mir is pretty much done now and if he does win, I really don't see him getting too far anyways.

But I'm really hoping the old Mir comes back and he can get his career back on track.

Shogun
11-25-2007, 07:52 AM
Mir, for sure.

ufobydeath
11-25-2007, 08:14 PM
If Mir loses he's officially a has-been. If Lesnar loses "Mir was a HW champion! Bad match-up!".

So, I'd say Mir needs it more. Of course Nate Deezy makes a great point in that Lesnar will have to be on the recieving end of a lot of wrasslin-bashing... but as soon as he gets a few wins going it will all wash away IMO.

In the end they both need it but losing here isn't the end of Lesnar's career; for Mir it is.