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View Full Version : The Rubber Guard: Stop Hating



initial_zen
11-28-2008, 03:10 AM
just curious what some of the grapplers on here think of rubber guard

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Palma
11-28-2008, 11:53 AM
Frem my experience, the Rubber guard and the Electric chair are easy to escape with sound fundamental Jiu-Jitsu.

I think the Rubber guard works great for MMA.

Ramma
11-28-2008, 01:46 PM
I've always found the rubber guard to be an incredibly useful tool. You just have to have the flexibility and the will to work with it. I use the rubber guard whenever it feels like a good time to use it. More than anything, because people don't usually know what to do with it. It helps with sweeps, or even setting up a submission. The rubber guard can be difficult to pull off unless you are really good at it and if your opponent doesn't fully understand it.

Is it the new wave of BJJ? No, it isn't... regardless of what Bravo, Rogan, etc. want to believe. It is simply ANOTHER tool... new moves... but it is still BJJ.

Japanese Jiu-Jitsu is almost half Judo/Half BJJ (even though it came before BJJ, it is just a good way to describe it). Japanese JJ really is its own martial art.

Rubber Guard is just a collection of techniques in BJJ, but it isn't a whole new form of grappling.


As I said, I like rubber guard and I think it is effective... but it hasn't reinvented the style or created a new style, only adapted the current style.



By the way, there is a new grappling social group. Join up - MMA News Forums - The Grappler's Club (http://forums.mmanews.com/group.php?groupid=2)

AngryJohnny
11-28-2008, 03:38 PM
I'm very interested in his technique but still very new (7 months) to practicing BJJ. Being that flexibility is one of the few physical assets I have I feel like I should learn more about his style down the road - but I'm going to need someone in front of me demonstrating and correcting my fuck-ups. I thumbed through Mastering the Rubber Guard at Barnes and Nobles a few weeks back - it looks about as well laid out as a book can be, but I don't have a training partner anywhere nearby (have to drive 60 miles to get to class as it is)....and I don't think my fiance' would appreciate being subjected to sloppy gogo and twister attempts. :confusedsmilie:

For what it's worth, the subject of Eddie Bravo/Rubber Guard has come up in discussion several times from my classmates and they all (mostly white to purple) seem fairly open to it - or would if they had the chance to train it. Never did hear my instructor (bb) chime in one way or another.

Repenter
11-30-2008, 02:05 AM
i'm a pretty stocky build, at 6'0" and 215 lbs, with a background in wrestling. when i started doing jiu jitsu and mma, this is one of the first things i started trying out, after i saw a tutorial of bj penn using a gogoplata. i've gotten my flexibility to a point now (thanks to my countless attemped CC kicks :) ) where i use the meathook and mission control position regularly in control from the bottom. moreover, i love what bravo has done with no-gi JJ, and i really think it's a more practical art, and pays more dividends in my no-gi grappling (which is essentially submission wrestling) than traditional gi-jj does.

i must say though, i have to manually reach down and put my leg into place for the mission control position. watching eddie just fall onto his back and move his foot up to an opponant's ear is startling, and reminds me of the first time i saw bj penn throw on a gogoplata with no hands

thefirm0
12-01-2008, 10:17 PM
for me rubber guard sets up everything. i love scrambles and am really hard to submit, so i try shit with reckless abandon. i almost always try for a gogoplata with no intent on getting it, but when my opponent tries to escape it's nothing to transition right to omaplata, armbar, sweep, force stand up, whatever your looking for. it's MY most useful tool, so yeah stop hating!!

muscle_shark
12-02-2008, 04:35 PM
YouTube - Eddie Bravo - The Truth About The Rubber Guard (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvAmJbP8RQc)

very interesting clip. i personally think bravo is the man. he deserves all the respect in the world for the rubber guard. enjoy.

initial_zen
12-02-2008, 08:24 PM
posted in the grappling section, but good vid

muscle_shark
12-02-2008, 08:35 PM
my bad, i didnt check

initial_zen
12-03-2008, 04:44 AM
my bad, i didnt check

no problem, and do you have any opinion on the rubber guard?
im still very new too only about a year into grappling but i have been using it to set up oma plattas really nicely and am wondering if it is something i should invest in.

muscle_shark
12-03-2008, 09:53 AM
omaplattas are always useful. if you dont get the sub, the sweeps that can come out of it are incredible. then you gain top position and regain a dominant position. thats my opinion. a lot ppl i kno that train say its useless and only works on noobs but the anxiety that graplers go through when their arm is caught allows them to make mistakes or give you the sweep.

muscle_shark
12-04-2008, 12:56 AM
a good example of what im talkin about is seen in the guillard vs clementi fight from ufc 79. clementi gets on top by using an omaplatta sweep. check it out at mmalinker. its a download link from megavideo. heres the link.

http://mmalinker.com/xExternal.php?vidid=4005

Palma
12-04-2008, 12:34 PM
no problem, and do you have any opinion on the rubber guard?
im still very new too only about a year into grappling but i have been using it to set up oma plattas really nicely and am wondering if it is something i should invest in.

Stick to the basics as they will apply to every situation as where rubber guard will only work in certain situations on certain individuals...

Just work on your open guard in general, which will include practical applications of the rubber guard naturally.

If you try and force the Rubber guard too ofter people will figure it out and their entries will just have an automatic defense to it and they will penn down your pivioting foot and pass to side mount or just control your knee that goes behind the neck for Mission Control.

If you have a good open guard then you can transition to omoplatas, to arm-bars, to triangles more easily as well as set your opponent up for combos then you can from Rubber guard.

Kimura_Guy_2008
12-06-2008, 10:07 PM
I agree that Rubber Guard, The Twister and its stuff is just new tools to add to orthodox Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu. Eddie Bravo has mentioned that you have to know your basics. When you have your basics down, then you can add his 10th PJJ techniques into it. The combination of both orthodox and unorthodox (for now) techniques will make you, I would argue, a much tougher people to go up against. For example, you could have someone in regular side mount and starting hunting for a kimura or something. When the bottom person thinks that he/she is OK, then you can transition to a twister side control. I love to mount there. It is so much easier. When people turn into you, you can use the twister roll to take their back. Going back and forth makes you much more dangerous.

I've been training in BJJ for almost 2.5 years now. I use various techniques from Eddie's system. In terms of a top game, I use the twister side control quite often. I typically set guys up from there for the ninja roll. Although the twister itself is a banned submission, the roll itself is an awesome technique to take the back. I'm one of the smaller guys in the gym, so the roll to the back presented itself as a energy conserving technique to take the back. That's my top game thus far.

In terms of my guard game, I have a lot of 10th PJJ influence. My half-guard is almost entirely based off of Eddie's lockdown. The old school sweep and the electric chair sweep/submission have been very high percentage for me. Even if I don't sweep them, I usually start a scramble off that the puts me in a better position (most times). In terms of the rubber guard itself, I use it almost exclusively in my nogi training. In the gi, borrow some of the ideas. Some things I use a lot of, include: the Pump, Invisible collar, the swim move, Meathook to triangle, Teepee and the carni.

More generally though, I believe that Eddie's ideas promote better flexibility that will much benefit, in grain the idea of tightness in jiu jitsu rather than looseness and fostering creativity in jiu jitsu practitioners. It also teaches students a way to put together all the techniques that you learn. Instead of having 1,000 separate techniques, linking together might help a BJJ practitioner remember everything better.

Regarding the Gi/Noqi debate, I personally think that it's important to train both. I know some people say that training the Gi is important for the finest technique. I used to train exclusively in the gi. When I went to do some nogi, there were a lot of set ups that I had that required the gi that no longer existed in nogi. I believe that the gi does not always transition optimally to the nogi game.

I definitely enjoy his school and his techniques even though my only means of RG stuff is through youtube, his occasional canadian seminars and his two books.

Palma
12-07-2008, 07:00 PM
^^^^^^This may be one of the best posts I've ever read on an MMA forum.

DirtyDirtBiker
12-08-2008, 12:31 AM
I don't have much to say about the rubber guard b/c I haven't learned how to really use it.

I know those guys at the gym that have tried it, do not do it properly so its easy to escape from.

But man, after watching this vid, I would really love to spend some time training at bravo's school. I'm gonna actually see if it can be done.

killerinstinct
01-02-2009, 12:35 PM
To me the regular full guard is outdated and old fashioned, especially in no-gi competition. I think the techniques of the rubber guard, turtle guard, butterfly guard, and X-guard are much more effective. I think everyone should show Eddie Bravo and men like him a ton of respect for thinking outside of the box and for revolutionizing jiu-jitsu.

Palma
01-06-2009, 12:57 AM
To me the regular full guard is outdated and old fashioned, especially in no-gi competition. I think the techniques of the rubber guard, turtle guard, butterfly guard, and X-guard are much more effective. I think everyone should show Eddie Bravo and men like him a ton of respect for thinking outside of the box and for revolutionizing jiu-jitsu.

But it hasn't revolutionized Jiu-jistu... no one has one a world championship or even a national championship with the Rubber gaurd. Bravo didn't even win his championship with the rubber-guard. Not with the gi and without.

I'm not saying it doesn't work but it hasn't become a parctical gaurd in BJJ yet.

Closed guard will always be the best and most practical guard... the difference is most fighters know how to pass and evade a closed guard.

atj-lucko
01-09-2009, 01:24 AM
But it hasn't revolutionized Jiu-jistu... no one has one a world championship or even a national championship with the Rubber gaurd. Bravo didn't even win his championship with the rubber-guard. Not with the gi and without.

I'm not saying it doesn't work but it hasn't become a parctical gaurd in BJJ yet.

Closed guard will always be the best and most practical guard... the difference is most fighters know how to pass and evade a closed guard.

I have to disagree Anoki proves the rubber guard works. Closed guard is the worst against a lay and pray wrestler. Like the Sherk/Florian fight if that was Anoki and minus the blood I think the rubber guard would have been way better.

Palma
01-09-2009, 01:43 AM
I have to disagree Anoki proves the rubber guard works. Closed guard is the worst against a lay and pray wrestler. Like the Sherk/Florian fight if that was Anoki and minus the blood I think the rubber guard would have been way better.

Look at Nog, Maia, Alemdia, Penn, Werdum, etc... they all use closed guard and even Akoi uses the closed guard.

It doesn't favor the scoring but it doesn't mean it's not effective for subs and sweeps (and that is what we are talking about here).

If Florian tried to use the rubber guard on Sherk his guard would have been passed because it's just too easy to pass if your opponent knows what the hell he is doing.

I never said it doesn't work. I said it isn't as practical as the close guard. You can't sweep and are limited to a handfull of subs with the rubberguard.

But this totally besides the point because the question was raised that the Rubberguard has revolutioninzed BJJ and it hasn't.

Dioxippus
09-02-2009, 05:19 AM
I'm always impressed when I see a really dexterous fighter completely shut down a trigger-happy GnPer with it. Awesome stuff.

reedk
09-20-2009, 07:02 PM
The rubber guard is another good option for fighters. I'm not very good at it though. Guess it works better for some fighters than others.
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MrSpanky
03-29-2010, 12:32 PM
You have to train with people who really know it. Watching the videos online and reading his book do nothing if you can't see them practiced in front of you. After I finished the book I started training with a guy who has been using it forever, and I'm at least 5 times better at it now. For some reason the hard part for me is controlling the other guys posture and getting mission control and hand to mat...from there its hard for the other guy to escape and you usually submit him or advance the position.

Iron Triangle
09-10-2010, 11:58 PM
I, myself, am still on the bubble about the Rubber Guard.