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Old 10-21-2006, 12:20 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Pride Vs UFC

Let me say this out front...
I am not trolling here, just listen...

I truly believe that the only real things (fighters) that Pride has going for it (in regards to the seemingly ubiquitous "Pride is SOOO much better than UFC" argument) is Fedor and CroCop.

Once you take those two truly extraordinary fighters out of the equation (for the sake of an overall argument), the two organizations are basically equal. Take a gander at the the new MMAWeekly rankings (Current as of 10/17/2006):

HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION

1. Fedor Emelianenko

2. Mirko Cro Cop

3. Josh Barnett

4. Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira

5. Tim Sylvia

6. Andrei Arlovski

7. Aleksander Emelianenko

8. Fabricio Werdum

9. Mark Hunt

10. Sergei Kharitonov


LIGHT HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION

1. Chuck Liddell

2. Mauricio "Shogun" Rua

3. Wanderlei Silva

4. Ricardo Arona

5. Antonio Rogerio Nogueira

6. Renato "Babalu" Sobral

7. Tito Ortiz

8. Quinton Jackson

9. Alistair Overeem

10. Kazuhiro Nakamura



MIDDLEWEIGHT DIVISION

1. Matt Lindland

2. Anderson Silva

3. Rich Franklin

4. Paulo Filho

5. Dan Henderson

6. Denis Kang

7. Jeremy Horn

8. Kazuo Misaki

9. Nathan Marquardt

10. Amar Suloev



WELTERWEIGHT DIVISION

1. Matt Hughes

2. Georges St. Pierre

3. BJ Penn

4. Diego Sanchez

5. Karo Parisyan

6. Jake Shields

7. Jon Fitch

8. Akira Kikuchi

9. Nick Diaz

10. Joe Riggs


LIGHTWEIGHT DIVISION

1. Takanori Gomi

2. Hayato Sakurai

3. Tatsuya Kawajiri

4. Joachim Hansen

5. Norifumi "Kid" Yamamoto

6. Vitor "Shaolin" Ribeiro

7. Marcus Aurelio

8. Mitsuhiro Ishida

9. Sean Sherk

10. Gilbert Melendez







One caveat I may add (in regard to the above MMAWeekly rankings) is the lightweight division...

Look at who the UFC has signed:

Tyson Griffin

Roger Huerta

Melvin Guillard

Hermes Franca

Joe Stevenson


EDIT: Ahhhh!. I hit "Submit thread" instead of "Preview Post"... Anyway, my basic argument stands....

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Old 10-21-2006, 12:54 AM   #2 (permalink)
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I don't have anyone biased torwards the other I really love them both.

HW-I'll take the top 4 Pride HW's over anything the UFC has to offer.-Pride

LHW-Chuck's the best LHW in the world ,but pride has more depth.-Pride

MW-Close ,but Pride definately has an edge.-Pride

WW-UFCs ww division is phenominal and rivals any other divison in any company.-UFC

LW-Pride obviously takes this ,but give it a few years and I think it'll be a much more even picture.-Pride

Pride wins 4-1 and the one the UFC did score doesn't even really count since Pride doesn't have a steady WW division.
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Old 10-21-2006, 01:02 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
LHW-Chuck's the best LHW in the world ,but pride has more depth.-Pride
I guess you forgot Quinton Jackson stills holds a win over Chucks head?
And i am ample to say Matt linland could take Chuck as well

And i by far Vanderli Silva is a far better LHW Champion than Chuck ever was or will be. Silva has defended his for years against formidable oppents . Chuck has fought Whom? Babalu , Horn and Couture since having the belt. SO how is he the best? LHW in the world?

Plus he wouldn't hold a torch to Crocop
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Old 10-21-2006, 01:25 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Mr Frost u make me laugh.

I think both the first two arguments from blightsmite and killer instinct are spot on. There is no doubt the depth in many of the divisions belongs to Pride.

As for Chuck, yeah Jackson had a win over Chuck 3 years ago, a lots changed since then and it was in Jacksons Pride world, the cage changes a lot of things.

Silva defended his title, dont make me laugh, he's put it on the line vs random Jap fighters who've been fed to him. He's lost 3 times in the last 2 years. Chuck hasn't lost since Jackson in 2003. Couture, Horn and Baba are much tougher opponents than anyone Wandy has beaten in the last 3 years bar possibly Jackson. Chuck is the more accomplished fighter.

Yeah Cro Cop might tear Chuck apart, but he's a heavyweight and one of the best strikers in the world, he should be expected to.
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Old 10-21-2006, 01:35 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b0sH
Mr Frost u make me laugh.

I think both the first two arguments from blightsmite and killer instinct are spot on. There is no doubt the depth in many of the divisions belongs to Pride.

As for Chuck, yeah Jackson had a win over Chuck 3 years ago, a lots changed since then and it was in Jacksons Pride world, the cage changes a lot of things.

Silva defended his title, dont make me laugh, he's put it on the line vs random Jap fighters who've been fed to him. He's lost 3 times in the last 2 years. Chuck hasn't lost since Jackson in 2003. Couture, Horn and Baba are much tougher opponents than anyone Wandy has beaten in the last 3 years bar possibly Jackson. Chuck is the more accomplished fighter.

Yeah Cro Cop might tear Chuck apart, but he's a heavyweight and one of the best strikers in the world, he should be expected to.

You make me laugh random jap fighter ( spell japanese ) it really makes you sound uneducated and a raciest .

Loss Mirko Filipovic KO (Head Kick) PRIDE-Final Conflict Absolute 9/10/2006 1 5:26
Win Kazuyuki Fujita TKO (Strikes) PRIDE-Critical Coutdown Absolute 7/1/2006 1 9:21
Win Ricardo Arona Decision (Split) PRIDE-Shockwave 2005 12/31/2005 3 5:00
Loss Ricardo Arona Decision (Unaminous) PRIDE-Final Conflict 2005 8/28/2005 2 5:00
Win Kazuhiro Nakamura TKO (Strikes) PRIDE-Critical Countdown 2005 6/26/2005 1 5:24
Win Hidehiko Yoshida Decision (Split) PRIDE-Total Elimination 2005 4/23/2005 3 5:00
Loss Mark Hunt Decision (Split) PRIDE-Shockwave 2004 12/31/2004 3 5:00
Win Quinton Jackson KO PRIDE 28-High Octane 10/31/2004 2 3:26

Silva fought guys out of his weight class on a few occassions! And last i checked Mark Hunt , Arona, crocop aren't slouches !

And his win record weren't any random fighters they were guys in japan that earned their spot ! Regardless of race ! Silva has defended all all comers ! And if UFC hadn't backed out l;ast time maybe would could have seen a Silva vs Couture !

Also

Silva's other notable wins in PRIDE include Guy Mezger (2001, KO), Dan Henderson (2001, decision), Hidehiko Yoshida (twice, 2003 and 2005, via decisions), and Yuki Kondo (2004, KO) among others. In Japan, Silva additionally gained his reputation as a fighter who has never been defeated by any Japanese opponent, resulting in a trend of various Japanese fighters being arranged by PRIDE to face him.


Silva's undefeated streak in PRIDE was broken by Mark Hunt, a K-1 Grand Prix champion, on December 31, 2004 at the PRIDE Shockwave 2004 event. Hunt won the non-title match by split decision over Silva. The decision was controversial because some felt that Hunt's weight at 250 lb (113 kg), nearly 50 pounds over Silva, as well as Silva's dominance in round 3, had not been sufficiently considered by the judges in their decision; Randy Couture and Bas Rutten, both being commentators at the event, expressed disagreement over the decision

31 wins, 6 losses, 1 draw, 1 no contest



Plus Chucks first 3 title defenses were only
8/26/2006 Win Renato Sobral UFC 62 TKO (Strikes) 1 1:35
02/04/2006 Win Randy Couture UFC 57 KO (Punch) 2 1:38
08/20/2005 Win Jeremy Horn UFC 54 TKO (Strikes) 4 2:46

And the horn fight and couture he was winded. He couldn't last with Silva more than 2 rounds which was his problem against Rampage he has no steam past a few rounds!
Thats how Couture beat him the first time!

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Old 10-21-2006, 04:27 AM   #6 (permalink)
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[QUOTE=Mr.Frost]!Silva's undefeated streak in PRIDE was broken by Mark Hunt, a K-1 Grand Prix champion, on December 31, 2004 at the PRIDE Shockwave 2004 event. Hunt won the non-title match by split decision over Silva. The decision was controversial because some felt that Hunt's weight at 250 lb (113 kg), nearly 50 pounds over Silva, as well as Silva's dominance in round 3, had not been sufficiently considered by the judges in their decision; Randy Couture and Bas Rutten, both being commentators at the event, expressed disagreement over the decision QUOTE]


I understand you accounting for the weight difference and the decision was iffy, although I could see it going either way - but you forget to mention that Hunt took that fight on short notice and it was only hos third MMA fight. So the loss is not that excusable.
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Old 10-21-2006, 06:52 AM   #7 (permalink)
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so who is the idiot starting UFC Vs. Pride thread again? Oh damn.I could have guessed...

Pride has better fighters and even UFC fans admit it. End of story.

How long have you been watching MMA?
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Old 10-21-2006, 07:08 AM   #8 (permalink)
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[QUOTE=juliodenero]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Frost
!Silva's undefeated streak in PRIDE was broken by Mark Hunt, a K-1 Grand Prix champion, on December 31, 2004 at the PRIDE Shockwave 2004 event. Hunt won the non-title match by split decision over Silva. The decision was controversial because some felt that Hunt's weight at 250 lb (113 kg), nearly 50 pounds over Silva, as well as Silva's dominance in round 3, had not been sufficiently considered by the judges in their decision; Randy Couture and Bas Rutten, both being commentators at the event, expressed disagreement over the decision QUOTE]


I understand you accounting for the weight difference and the decision was iffy, although I could see it going either way - but you forget to mention that Hunt took that fight on short notice and it was only hos third MMA fight. So the loss is not that excusable.

What the hell does taking the fight on short notice have anything to do with the guys weight difference ? Silva didn't use no excuse moron he took the loss in stride. I'm pointing out as did the rest of the MMA world. Silva farred well against a tough fighter that was well past his weight class PERIOD !

My examples weren't to difuse Silva standing in Pride just to compare his greatness being better than that of Chuck! PERIOD !
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Old 10-21-2006, 07:22 AM   #9 (permalink)
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[QUOTE=Mr.Frost]
Quote:
Originally Posted by juliodenero


PERIOD !

My examples weren't to difuse Silva standing in Pride just to compare his greatness being better than that of Chuck! PERIOD !

You sir, are funny!!
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Old 10-21-2006, 07:32 AM   #10 (permalink)
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[QUOTE=kickass32]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Frost


You sir, are funny!!

If you mean by funny as in Silva is less than a fighter than Chuck than i would say your smoking lead paint chips. If my sayig funny haha for no reason than fine have at it
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