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[Y2JUBAE]

Originally Posted by earle

Hahahahaha!

I still think Matt Hughes is the greatest WW of all time based on his whole volume of work, but I think GSP has the potential to overtake him eventually.

I think Dana said Matt was the greatest champion ever... Ever! to Matt after he beat BJ in fight 2. I think Matt's next opponent was GSP to whom he lost lol. Dana is a jinx!

I'm with you about Hughes though. GSP is on the verge of passing him, but not just yet IMO.

[PaydayJones]

Originally Posted by goodtimes

Did you really need to ask what a highlight reel has to do with anything? If it wasn't for Jon Jones' ability to pull off crazy moves left and right, no one would care about him. Tons of people are considering him invincible because he beat a few top 20 LHW's in spectacular fashion.

I don't agree with that assesment at all. Jones is getting the pub he is getting because he is 11 - 1 with the 1 being a self inflicted dq. If Jones was 6 - 5 in that span with the vicious knockouts he wouldn't get half the hype. It's is record that drives his face time.

I gave you Lytle as an example, another good one is Rampage. Would anyone mistake him for the greatest of all time? No, probably not. Is his highlight reel among the best ever? Just ask Ricardo Arona, he'd say yes and he's part of it!...

In the discussion of who is the greatest of all time, the highlight reel is unimportant. It MIGHT separate 1a from 1b, but you can't exclude someone just because you think their wins are boring.

[rivethead]

Originally Posted by PaydayJones

I gave you Lytle as an example, another good one is Rampage. Would anyone mistake him for the greatest of all time? No, probably not. Is his highlight reel among the best ever? Just ask Ricardo Arona, he'd say yes and he's part of it!

I'm betting Arona would take the opportunity to point out that the slam should never had happened, in that he had jackson KO'd in his guard and the crackhead/crooked ref didn't stop the fight, even when Arona stopped striking, looked back and told him he was out. Then he'd point out that the slam wasn't what KO'd him, it was the inadvertent head butt at the end of it, and show you the teeth marks to prove it.

rh

[PaydayJones]

Originally Posted by rivethead

I'm betting Arona would take the opportunity to point out that the slam should never had happened, in that he had jackson KO'd in his guard and the crackhead/crooked ref didn't stop the fight, even when Arona stopped striking, looked back and told him he was out. Then he'd point out that the slam wasn't what KO'd him, it was the inadvertent head butt at the end of it, and show you the teeth marks to prove it.

rh

And then when all of that was done, he'd still be a part of a highlight reel that ranks near the top from a fighter who at best is no where near the greatest of all time, thus making your contribution here pretty much irrelivant to the conversation, but since you brought it up, any fighter who stops fighting prior to the ref stopping the fight is a fool.

[Pasha K]

No he is not the greatest of all time. Maybe one day he will be it, but today is not that day.

Skills, quality opponents, respect, that is all great but he is not the only one who has all that.

For me the greatest of all time so far is obviously Fedor, he is the most well rounded fighter in the world, the most respectful, has faced a lot of Top 10 competition, was undefeated for 10 years.

[CHAEL fan]

Originally Posted by Pashak

No he is not the greatest of all time. Maybe one day he will be it, but today is not that day.

Skills, quality opponents, respect, that is all great but he is not the only one who has all that.

For me the greatest of all time so far is obviously Fedor, he is the most well rounded fighter in the world, the most respectful, has faced a lot of Top 10 competition, was undefeated for 10 years.

Well, I'll give you points for being consistent.

[goodtimes]

Originally Posted by PaydayJones

I don't agree with that assesment at all. Jones is getting the pub he is getting because he is 11 - 1 with the 1 being a self inflicted dq. If Jones was 6 - 5 in that span with the vicious knockouts he wouldn't get half the hype. It's is record that drives his face time.

I gave you Lytle as an example, another good one is Rampage. Would anyone mistake him for the greatest of all time? No, probably not. Is his highlight reel among the best ever? Just ask Ricardo Arona, he'd say yes and he's part of it!...

In the discussion of who is the greatest of all time, the highlight reel is unimportant. It MIGHT separate 1a from 1b, but you can't exclude someone just because you think their wins are boring.

Bader is 12-0, with a win over Nogueira. A lot more impressive then any opponent Jones has beat, yet who has more hype behind them? There are dozens of fighters with good records out there, but none of them fight like Jones.

The perfect example of how a fighter fights meaning just as much as their record is Gray Maynard. Right now, he has the best record of any LW out there. He fights top fighters every go, and he outpoints them in pretty boring affairs. He hardly gets any respect, even after beating Kenny Florian. Or how about comparing Frankie Edgar to Jose Aldo? After Edgar beat Sherk, no one really cared. After Aldo KO'd Cub Swanson in 8 seconds, people were calling him the next big thing. Edgar beat Penn in the first fight. Everyone considered it a fluke, he didn't really win, etc. Aldo annihilates Mike Brown. People are already calling the guy the greatest FW of all time, and are wondering how he would do against BJ Penn.

While I'm saying the method of victory is incredibly important for a fighter, it doesn't mean I think its the only thing that matters. Of course Chris Lytle is not a top fighter, he loses lots of fights. Of the fighters I mentioned in previous posts (Liddell, Wanderlei, Anderson, Fedor), all of them had longer win streaks then GSP. But on top of the longer streaks, they put on incredible shows. When Liddell fought a guy who he clearly outmatched, he went after him and KO'd him. Same with Wanderlei. Anderson Silva has pulled off, imo, the most incredible performances of any fighter (the uppercut elbow KO of Frykland, the destruction of Griffin and Franklin, pulling off the out of nowhere triangle on Sonnen, even his DQ loss to Okami was crazy). Fedor is clearly the GOAT, he has brutal KO's, slick submissions, epic wars, and an incredible unbeaten streak where he fought the best HW's in the world. To top it off, he is a very small HW.

[DanC]

Originally Posted by macewen

thats a great point. being the best is not about highlight reels, its about consistently beating the best fighters. Not only that, when was the last time gsp actually lost a round?

Agreed. I mean there certainly is an argument for the idea that to be the greatest of all-time you have to fulfill all of the criteria in the article AND be an exciting fighter (as MMA is a commercial sport nowadays, where exciting fighters are given more worth than unexciting ones), but just because GSP's victories are technical-shutdowns, where he dominantly neutralises his opponents strengths, it doesn't make it any less impressive, just less exciting.

[rivethead]

Originally Posted by PaydayJones

And then when all of that was done, he'd still be a part of a highlight reel that ranks near the top from a fighter who at best is no where near the greatest of all time, thus making your contribution here pretty much irrelivant to the conversation, but since you brought it up, any fighter who stops fighting prior to the ref stopping the fight is a fool.

I'm not saying he's not a fool, although much of the blame lies on the crooked officials in PRIDE. I'm saying he probably wouldn't say yes to your question.

He might be part of it, but I just don't think he's going to say it was great. He's going to say it never should have happened.

rh

[vegas bushido]

Yes what a terrible article! People claiming GSP is the GOAT after crushing everyone in the division and some twice! Fucking clown writer.