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[Pasha K]

As for Nog's chin, I think that started to go when Herring dropped that high-kick nuke on him. The fact that Nog survived that and went on to win is almost as unbelievable as Herring's complete lack of interest in following him to the ground and finishing him. I know he was super wary of Nog's guard, but two solid hammer fists and the history of the UFC heavyweight division post-PRIDE merger could have been vastly different

Personally I do not think there is one single moment when Nog's chin got weaker.
Through years he took a lot lot of punishment. He took Mirko's punches and kicks, he survived the brutal GnP Fedor unleashed on him. He was knocked down so many times.
The Herring's kick contributed to that.

I think all that punishment got accumulated and his chin can not take anymore so strong punches. I personally do not think at all that Cain would KO him about 5 years ago. Cain, as a great fighter as he is, does not has the most vicious KO power.

[lwbrewer]

To say Rua hasn't put his body through a lot of abuse is crazy. Most abuse comes from training were it's done over and over verses up to 25 min of fight time verses a 8 week training camp. Yes head violet injuries are more likely in a fight as practice can use head gear. So if a tennis players injury their elbows key board warriors do their wrists. I'd say all 10 year vet fighters have extreme wear too

[Dr. MMA]

Originally Posted by Sakara=Excitement

I may be wrong, you probably know better than I do Pashak but wasn't Cro Cop very anti cage training when he was coming in to the UFC and never fully adopted training in a cage?

Also I've heard in that fight against Gonzaga, Cro Cop didn't train for elbows on the ground and he never recovered from that huge one in the 1st round.

Cro Copy was very anti cage training and yes he didn't train elbows or in the cage for the Gonzaga fight. He then realized he should train in the cage, but decided to do it in a smaller cage that really threw off his timing. Finally, he decided to get the same size cage as the octagon. However, along the way he decided to abandon all striking from his right, and only go to his straight left, left body kick and left high kick, which made him quite predictable.

[Masscore]

At the end of the day Shogun's knees are just blown. He is a guy that is going to be cut down by injuries and have a shortened career. The fact he has remained a top level fighter without knees is nothing short of amazing when you think about.

He has way too long of lay offs now and when you have bad knees your cardio suffers. The only reason he made the comeback against Hendo was because of Hendo having the flu. Watching his fight Vera I am even more convinced that a healthy Hendo would have finished Shogun before the end of the 4th round. He is going to hoover around the Top 5 for a little while longer but smart money says this time next year Shogun will either be ranked in the 8-10 range or competely out of the rankings all together. Too much new and healthy blood in the division for him to keep up with.

[sonofsteven]

Ehh this article just seems to be a lengthy way of saying; Shogun needs to stop ignoring his questionable cardio as he has sooo many times in his career.

[Y2JUBAE]

Shogun beat the best Vera I've seen. Stood with him, TKO'd him... Not sure what this "article" is about.

[disposableassassin]

Originally Posted by SimpleJack

Crocop had a perfect storm of negatives, lack of preparation for a cage, over-reliance on the lhk, constant focus on the ground game, age, and outside activities. Didn't he once simply admit that fighting wasn't his top priority as well?

i remember one time cro cop was saying that he was thinking about fishing during his walk to the cage to fight.

[Masscore]

Originally Posted by Y2JUBAE

Shogun beat the best Vera I've seen. Stood with him, TKO'd him... Not sure what this "article" is about.

The article is pointing out a few things. Sure Shogun won but Vera is a guy that Shogun back in 2005-2006 would have put away in less then a round. Sure he won by TKO but watch that fight and tell me that Vera wasn't getting the better of the stand-up battle and was forcing Shogun to shot for takedowns.

The fact is in 3 of Shoguns last 4 fights he has lost in the stand-up game. Jones, Hendo and Vera all got the better of Shogun standing. This is Shogun we are talking about. The guy who outpointed and TKO Machida, TKO'd Rampage, Liddell and Overeem is losing stand-up battles to the likes of Jones, Hendo and Vera. Something is wrong with him and IMO it's the knee injuries.

[IceCold48]

Originally Posted by Masscore

The article is pointing out a few things. Sure Shogun won but Vera is a guy that Shogun back in 2005-2006 would have put away in less then a round. Sure he won by TKO but watch that fight and tell me that Vera wasn't getting the better of the stand-up battle and was forcing Shogun to shot for takedowns.

The fact is in 3 of Shoguns last 4 fights he has lost in the stand-up game. Jones, Hendo and Vera all got the better of Shogun standing. This is Shogun we are talking about. The guy who outpointed and TKO Machida, TKO'd Rampage, Liddell and Overeem is losing stand-up battles to the likes of Jones, Hendo and Vera. Something is wrong with him and IMO it's the knee injuries.

Shogun clearly out struck Vera what are you talking about? And I wouldn't say hendo got the better of him standing it was back and forth and in the 4th and 5th rounds hendo literally did nothing.

[IceCold48]

Originally Posted by Dr. MMA

People criticize Shogun at times of not fighting smart, even though I feel he is one of the few fighters who uses all of their tools and mixes it up better than most LHWs. The fact is Shogun has went for the takedown against every single opponent, whether they were a great striker (like Vera or Machida), a good striker (like Chuck or Hendo), an average striker (like Forrest) or a quite mediocre striker (like Coleman). It's just a part of his game that he will go for takedowns when it presents themselves. Even though he has some of the most horrendous TDD, he is very successful in his takedowns; with the exception of Jon Jones, he has taken down all of his opponents in the UFC.

Yea I disregarded machida in my original post idk why brain fart.

And I agree about the takedowns shogun would rather ground and pound then stand up that's for sure but he hasn't been to successful with it in the UFC.

He did finish machida and forrest from the top but that was after a knockdown not a takedown.