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  • 07-12-2008, 07:51 PM
    LefthookStcrook
    Well i read the article, deffinatly a good read. It does seem the UFC dicked him around a bit waiting for a fight eh, props for posting a source. I cant really be surprised, they've dont it before. But still even he mentions his weight might have been a reason they "didn't want me"

    Q. So any shows in America, open to negotiation?
    A. Absolutely bro, I mean if the dollars are right I will fight. It doesn’t have to be UFC. I think one reason they didn’t want me is because I am too fat. Once upon a time they offered me ***,***$ to fight on a show when I was getting way more on Pride. So it was not enough, well that’s what my manger said. I was in good form but maybe the weight issue stopped them and of course the money. America is a good option and I will beat whoever I have to.

    His weight could have been a reason for them shelfing him,(they shelfed hendo for no reason) everyone knows the 265 limit, whats Dana gonna do with a fighter whose ready is ready to fight, but cant make weight? Nothing.

    Im sure if Hunt was under weight and told them he was ready to fight, he would have gotten a fight, granted it might have taken a while(see hendo), but he would have got one. If he could make weight i truly beileve he would be fighting in the UFC, why would they contact him if they had no intrest in him

    and yes plama i was deffinatly "owned", i jus asked if he had a source cuz lots of people make statements like that without acually knowing for sure, it happens all the time:headscratch:
  • 07-12-2008, 07:20 PM
    Diegonightmare
    I do think that the effort to be an armchair matchmaker and to be critical of Joe Silva's work is < than the actual difficulty of Joe Silva's job.

    Secondly I think that it's easy to look at anyone's job and think "how hard can that be, sheesh" but once you're in the position suddenly you become aware of 10x the difficulties, the stakeholders, the conflicting priorities, the considerations, the complexity, etc etc that you thought were there.

    Thirdly I think Silva's job by its nature is one that I don't give a damn HOW well he did it, there would be a decent % of MMA fans (who are by their nature a pretty cagey bunch, no pun intended) that would take issue with it. The old damned if you do and damned if you don't.

    We've discussed at good length more than a few times on these boards the problem of building up a fighter's hype by letting him fight people he can beat, vs. always giving him huge fights or giving him those fights right off the bat. Both of them have their pros and cons, and we can go over all of that ground again in this thread if anyone's forgotten.

    I think Silva does a good job and I think he's improving in his job. The matchups and the cards over the last, let's say year to 15 months, IMO have been very good overall.

    Would I, personally, do some things differently in his role than he does? For sure. For one I'm a fan, so I'd want more superfights. I'd want title fights more often. But if I were actually in his role, and had to deal with all the complexity he has to deal with, then by definition I'd no longer be "me" - that is, just matchmaking from a fan's perspective - so it becomes more difficult to so easily generalize.
  • 07-12-2008, 06:43 PM
    Palma
    owned...
  • 07-12-2008, 06:36 PM
    neonatural45
    Quote Originally Posted by Lefthookstcrook View Post
    Source for that?

    From my understanding Hunt was signed with the UFC they had him in the US and were talking about proposed matches when Hunt himself told them(Silva,Dana or whoever)that he wouldnt be able to or would have trouble making the 265 pound limit, weeks after the deal fell through. I never herd anything about Hunt saying he could make weight, and the UFC saying "OK cool hows next year sound?"

    MMANEWS.COM | Dana White Unleashes Loads Of Big News On Ferrall Show

    10th Bullet down, dana says Hunt is under contract, from the old PRIDE contract. ill try to find the other thread about him saying he wont/couldnt make 265 cuz i know i read it here.
    You really expect Dana to just say "well yah, we offered him stuff, didn't deliver though" If it did happen?

    anyways here is the link to the interview

    Rogue Magazine - Re-match Fedor for Soldier of Fortune
  • 07-12-2008, 05:53 PM
    LefthookStcrook
    Quote Originally Posted by neonatural45 View Post
    The UFC highers scouts to watch the smaller orgs and well..... scout. Plus Yoshiyuki Yoshida beat Kikuchi so he was pretty well known. I agree with the short notice fighters though, that must be frustrating as hell.



    Rampage wasn't in Pride went he signed with the UFC, they bought the org he was in.

    Not to mention you named 6 fighters out of Pride's whole roster. He only did well with one division, that being lightheavyweights and he still didn't sign guys like Lil Nog and Arona (who is still a free agent as far as I know.)


    Not to mention he did dick moves to some of the fighters, such as offering Joachim Hansen have his regular contract to fight in the UFC, and telling Mark Hunt that he was going to fight and leaving him on the shelf for a year.
    Source for that?

    From my understanding Hunt was signed with the UFC they had him in the US and were talking about proposed matches when Hunt himself told them(Silva,Dana or whoever)that he wouldnt be able to or would have trouble making the 265 pound limit, weeks after the deal fell through. I never herd anything about Hunt saying he could make weight, and the UFC saying "OK cool hows next year sound?"

    MMANEWS.COM | Dana White Unleashes Loads Of Big News On Ferrall Show

    10th Bullet down, dana says Hunt is under contract, from the old PRIDE contract. ill try to find the other thread about him saying he wont/couldnt make 265 cuz i know i read it here.
  • 07-12-2008, 05:32 PM
    neonatural45
    Quote Originally Posted by LethalStriker View Post
    Any idiot can armchair matchmake, you all can't hold a candle to what Joe Silva does. Part of his job is to recruit and find new fighters and keep on building up the UFC roster. How many of you people knew who Roger Huerta, Martin Kampmann, Goran Reljic, Cain Velasquez or Yoshiyuki Yoshida were before they debuted in UFC? Probably none of you. And considering how much overtime Joe Silva had to work on the UFC 85 card proves the job isn't that easy. Anyone can write up a handful of fight cards on paper but getting the fighters to agree to the specific matchups, dealing with fighters having medical suspensions and all that isn't that easy.
    The UFC highers scouts to watch the smaller orgs and well..... scout. Plus Yoshiyuki Yoshida beat Kikuchi so he was pretty well known. I agree with the short notice fighters though, that must be frustrating as hell.

    Quote Originally Posted by Killinginthenameof View Post
    how didn't he do a good job with signing Pride fighters? He def. went after the heavyweights and middleweights in getting: Wandy, Cro Cop, Hendo, Nog, Rampage, Shogun. All these Pride guys were free agents so they were free to do as they pleased.
    Rampage wasn't in Pride went he signed with the UFC, they bought the org he was in.

    Not to mention you named 6 fighters out of Pride's whole roster. He only did well with one division, that being lightheavyweights and he still didn't sign guys like Lil Nog and Arona (who is still a free agent as far as I know.)


    Not to mention he did dick moves to some of the fighters, such as offering Joachim Hansen have his regular contract to fight in the UFC, and telling Mark Hunt that he was going to fight and leaving him on the shelf for a year.


    edit: Martin Kampmann also came over in the WFA deal
  • 07-12-2008, 05:06 PM
    LefthookStcrook
    Quote Originally Posted by LethalStriker View Post
    There's no reason at all why Hunt can't make 265 except for the fact that he's just too lazy to get down in weight properly. He'd rather just fight in Japan without having to worry about cutting weight. He's what 5'10" or so, how can someone at that height not be able to make 265 unless they just don't want to?
    Yea pretty much, hes made under 265 before(i really cant remember which fight) and its a shame he wouldnt do it to fight on the biggest stage in north america Oh well i guess, my point is that is was Marks fault, Joe Silva cant be blamed for not bringing Hunt to the UFC, cuz he did. Its all up to Mark after that
  • 07-12-2008, 04:13 PM
    LethalStriker
    There's no reason at all why Hunt can't make 265 except for the fact that he's just too lazy to get down in weight properly. He'd rather just fight in Japan without having to worry about cutting weight. He's what 5'10" or so, how can someone at that height not be able to make 265 unless they just don't want to?
  • 07-12-2008, 04:05 PM
    LefthookStcrook
    Quote Originally Posted by sandywh View Post
    Rampage is marketable was pushed. I personally think Nog was set up w/ Herring to lose. A lot of people though CroCop got setup for failure against GG, I'm one of them.

    Herring and Silva came over early so they weren't held down. But look at Henderson. Put on the shelf for that long only to fight Rampage and Silva in his first 2 fights. Damn! I can understand not wanting to pay some of the guys their Pride contracted money, but why not get at least one fight from Hunt? or any of the other guys they let sit for a year?
    I gotta disagree here man alot of the PRIDE fighters were set-up to be champions, think about it for a sec:

    Rampage got a title shot in his 2nd fight after beating Marvin Fucking Eastman!

    Anderson got a title shot in his 2nd fight after beating Chris Leben

    Cro Cop was fed a HUGE can(bigger then Eastman) in Eddie sanchez and fought for the #1 Contender spot in his 2nd fight(GG). Did you really think CC was "set-up" to fail aginst GG? come on man be honest with yourself, that was one of the biggest upsets in MMA history

    Dan Henderson came into the UFC and fought for the LHW title in his 1st fight then for the MW title in his 2nd fight

    And NOG fought Herring in his 1st fight then got a title shot in his 2nd fight

    I dunno how anyone can say the were"set-up for defeat"
    Alot of them fought for the title in under 2 fights, everyone always says/said PRIDE fighters were better and dana wanted to find out,and we did, some were and some werent.

    The only ones i could see someone making a case for being "Set-up" is:

    Soko- got thrown to Machida in his 1st fight(When the hype was surrounding him)

    Shogun- Fought TUF1 Winner Forrest, everyone thought Shogun would blow past Forrest so i dont think this was a " set-up" either, Forrest pulled off the upset

    And Wandy- Fought Chuck in his 1st UFC fight, yea thats a pretty rough fight but there was bad blood and a fight that was 6 years in the making

    Just dont think they were set up for failure bud, JMO tho:headscratch:



    And PS: Hunt WAS offered a UFC contract but told them he would have trouble making the 265pound limit(i know i know hes made it before) but for some reason he told them he would have trouble making the weight so they said fuck it
  • 07-12-2008, 04:01 PM
    ChuckBooty
    A couple suspect match-ups that come to mind are Cro Cop/Sanchez and Pulver/Lauzon. Neither of those fights worked out how the UFC wanted them to...but I think this policy of "warm up fights" is pretty much over. Thank God.
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