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Topic Review (Newest First)

  • 09-07-2011, 05:47 AM
    Kimbo> Rampage
    Shogun is better at reversals, getting up, top control, and in the scrambles. That is saying a lot, but would he sub Anderson? Would he even be able to get him down, or even attempt it?

    If it was a pure Bjj match, you could argue for shogun. But Anderson is very aggressive off his back at times and has proven to be a threat on the ground.
  • 09-07-2011, 02:51 AM
    Masscore
    Quote Originally Posted by rampage9712 View Post
    I dont know about that. He is good on top and has great GNP. But saying shogun is on another level than Anderson in BJJ is speculation. I havent seen anything to prove that.

    Oh wait shogun subbed Randallman...
    Shogun is Brazilian National Champion in BJJ, so I think he would on paper have the advantage over Silva on the ground.
  • 09-07-2011, 02:33 AM
    Kimbo> Rampage
    Quote Originally Posted by Masscore View Post
    But Shogun is not stupid and probably would realize he just on another level then Silva when it comes to BJJ
    I dont know about that. He is good on top and has great GNP. But saying shogun is on another level than Anderson in BJJ is speculation. I havent seen anything to prove that.

    Oh wait shogun subbed Randallman...
  • 09-06-2011, 02:12 PM
    Masscore
    Everyone sees this as a striking fight but I think the difference is Shogun's ground game. If he can get the fight to the ground (easier said then done) then the fight shifts dramatically in favor of Shogun.

    If Shogun can not take Silva down, I think eventually Silva would KO him or outpoint him. But Shogun is not stupid and probably would realize he just on another level then Silva when it comes to BJJ. So I think after a few rounds standing Shogun puts Silva on his back and taps him with some kind of leg lock.
  • 09-06-2011, 01:31 PM
    Rise
    It be interesting to see Anderson fight someone who will actually throw kicks at him at least. If Shogun can get some damage in with the low kicks he could make it an interesting fight and have a shot at it.

    I think Jones or Rashad are the better bets at 205 to take Silva down though.
  • 09-06-2011, 06:20 AM
    dbader08
    I agree Anderson has sick muay thai and is a very smart fighter and his takedown D is very good but he does get taken down in most fights he's in (Lutter, Rich 2, Maruardt, Henderson, Leites, Maia, Sonnen), even though some of those TDs are very brief lol I just think Shogun is well rounded and dangerous enough and has the right mindset to possibly pull it out. Anderson's straight punches and front kicks could prove to be very detrimental to Shogun if this fight were to happen, which would not surprise me, I just think Shogun would be expecting that and fight patiently, and at least put up a good fight.

    I guess there is a chance this fight could happen, but I'd guess Anderson would rather fight a non-brazilian if he were to go to 205, even though Shogun did KO Machida. Anderson-Machida would be the most exciting very slow-paced counter fight of all time. It would be like feint-feint-feint-feint-feint-feint-feint-low kick-feint-feint-feint-jab-feint-striaght kick to the knee-feint-feint...
  • 09-06-2011, 05:55 AM
    Kimbo> Rampage
    I do think anderson has better tdd than forrest. Overeem has improved his tdd a lot, but I would have to disagree about him having good tdd in pride. Anderson is faster, more allusive, and more dangerous than the guys who shogun got down. Shogun does have good kicks and muay thai to set up shots or get inside like you said, but Anderson has had the best Muay Thai in mma as far back as his pride days. Anderson knows how to deal with kicks and make you pay for them.

    Too bad this fight will never happen along with Anderson vs. Machida.
  • 09-06-2011, 05:40 AM
    dbader08
    IDK man Overeem always had decent takedown D, who took him down other than Rua in pride, Arona? Possibly Lil nog after he gassed? Even in his first fight with Werdum, Werdum never took him down he took Werdum down and got kimura'd from guard. Forrest also had decent takedown D, not great but I don't think you can say it's no good at all.

    I know that Shogun's wrestling is the weakest part of his game but that is also the weakest part of Silva's game. If you can get Anderson to exchange there are openings for body locks and chances for the takedown as Hendo and Chael proved. They are much better wrestlers than Shogun yes, but still if Shogun gets both underhooks or a body lock he has a decent chance at the takedown or using his leglock to bring the fight down or take the back. I don't think you can say Anderson has better TDD than Forrest. Anderson would be harder to get ahold of, though. I think if Shogun used alot of kicks from a distance and forced Anderson to get aggressive with his hands, he could do good. I think Shoguns kicks are better and alot harder. Shogun has a very good chin, too. Alot of the people Silva fights get either impatient or lock up and don't know what to do. Shogun would be one of the most mentally strong people Anderson has faced, along with Dan Henderson.

    The reach of Anderson and the quickness of his hands and his overall elusiveness could very well win him the fight though, obviously. It would be interesting to see if Anderson fighting at 205 against an actual challenging opponent would make a difference.
  • 09-06-2011, 05:28 AM
    Kimbo> Rampage
    Anderson has never been known for having elite tdd, but Lil nog and Overeem(back in the pride days anyways) didnt have good tdd at all. Neither did forrest. He almost drags his opponents down, rather than landing a double leg, throw or sweep. He typically doesnt go for the takedown either. He will go for it when there is a struggle for position in the clinch or the scramble, but is typically not successful.

    Iv been following shoguns career since the start. He is one of my all time favorites but his takedowns and wrestling is clearly the weakest part of his game, not even close.

    He also has a good muay thai clinch of his own, but anderson would get the better of him there and thats not the best place to try and get anderson down.
  • 09-06-2011, 03:48 AM
    dbader08
    Quote Originally Posted by rampage9712 View Post
    I do agree that Anderson wouldnt be able to clown him. But if it turned into a technical muay thai fight, nobody beats Anderson 205down in mma.

    As good of a striker as machida is, anderson is better. Id put machida at 3rd, shogun at 2nd, and anderson at 1st for the best strikers in the UFC. Anderson is not easy to kick, we dont even see too many fighters try that on him now, but watch some of his earlier fights. Shogun having good takedowns? not sure about that, he has a very bad takedown % and not the best TDD himself. Still he does have vicious gnp when it does go there though.

    I said that Anderson wins for sure, but standup wise this would be the toughest fight 205down.
    Shogun doesn't have the best takedowns but he is definitely better at taking people down than defending the takedown. Plus, he is good at pulling off that standing leg lock, though he failed at using it versus Jones, though he got him to his back once but Jones quickly reversed. Plus, Anderson would be fighting at 205, its different than defending a takedown at 185, I'd imagine, though Shogun is not a very big 205er. Shogun was able to take down Nog, Overeem, and Forrest a few times who is a better wrestler than Silva imo. Shogun also would not be afraid to fight Anderson like alot of people who fight him are.

    Even if Shogun's takedown % is not that great, sometimes he is relentless with his attempts and when he gets on top he has a very good ground game and ground and pound. Do you have a statistic on his takedown %? Anderson defended the td easily against Okami but Okami looked horrible and didn't set it up at all. He never even tried to go for a single or a trip from what I remember, just stayed clinched with Anderson.
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