Originally Posted by IceCold48
nog and franklin? are you serious? nog is one of the top black blets in bjj. franklin very had much to offer in the grappling department.
Lol funny you mentioned that, A black belt isnt all you need to hold a edge imo.
But I thought it would make for some good talk, for some reason I find Wandys offensive JJ overhyped, lol by the talks of a Black belt
. That was my main reason for creating the thread with Wandy/Leben.
Wandy obviously holds a JJ blackbelt, does that automatically give him the edge over Leben? who hold twice as many subs as him? I dont think its as cut and dry as that myself.
As far as Franklin/Lil Nog goes, its alot closer
then you may think(imo of course). Franklin has 10 subs to his credit...while Lil nog has 6..almost half.
If you think Franklin is outclassed thats cool, why not put some effort into explaing your thoughts instead of basically just saying "Are you serious?, you have no idea what you're talking about"
Its called a discussion thread for a reason lol. I actually think Lil Nog/Frankling is alot closer then Leben/Wandy now that Im thinking about it.
IMO, the people picking Silva for the BJJ edge are either HUGE fans, or HUGE Pride lovers. The thing is
....Im both lol
, and I dont see how Silva has a JJ edge over Leben myself.
I only know of one legit sub win Wandy has, A RNC in the opening round of the 2000 GP.
So then I thought of a few Chris Leben subs, Akiyama, and Edwin Dewees. Both are pretty sketchy to say the least. Both are from the bottom, an armbar and a triangle. Also, at the very start of Chris Leben's career he had 9 wins, 4 via subs.
That "shows me" that Chris Leben is more comfortable going for subs off his back, and ultimatly more capable of pulling off a sub
IF it goes in that direction, mighty big if, again its all discussion lol.
Wandy, especially as far as transitioning and scrambling ability goes. Your going to have to be extremely slick to catch him in a submission, and it doesn't take someone with very slick bjj to submit Chris, as Rosholt and Mcdonald proved. Wandy's had fights where he's had submissions and just let them go, he just prefers to hit people in the face
There we go thats better lol. As far as Rosholt and Mcdonald go, Mcdonald is(imo) one of the better JJ artist at MW. And Rosholt..what can I say lol, Rosholt beat his ass
for sure, but tbh I think Leben was in a fucked up place at the time, I'm not going to make excuses but I dont think that fight would go the exact same in a rematch.
Good point about the transistion and scrambling, I find Leben is pretty good at getting back up to his feet when hes got the gas, his wrestling background isnt the most horrible. I wonder how that whole portion of the fight would play out.
As far as being extremly slick..I can agree to an extent. I cant see many people catching a fresh Wandy in the 1st.... I guess im picturing more of a 3rd round, bloody, tired battle finishing in a sub, much like Leben/Akiyama tbh.
Im just going by what I got to go by, past fights. And(to me) Leben seems way more comfortable at attempting subs, especially off his back. And with 5 armbars and 1 Triangle..compared to Wandys one RNC.. I gotta give the edge to Leben.
| Franklin has amazing sub defense. |
| you are underestimating Rich ALOT |
Thank you lol thats what im saying.
Lil nog hasnt been sub'd in almost 25 fights....no
easy feat for damn sure. Rich Franklin has gone on a 34-fight streak
without getting sub'd...again its much closer then people think.