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Thread: Fedor: If I was in my prime, I'd want to fight Cain

  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pasha K View Post
    I am sorry but JDS and specially BigFoot are not better fighters than Fedor.
    Both of them are one dimensional. JDS has his boxing, and BigFoot has his size. But overall Fedor was a much more complete fighter than them.

    Also you should know that MMA math is BS, you can't say "If Bigfoot destroyed Fedor and Cain destroyed Bigfoot, imagine what Cain would do to Fedor", because styles make fights and it has been proved several times why MMA math does not work.



    His striking looked good not only against Coleman. It looked good against K1 champions like Mirko or Hunt.
    He dominated in the ground Minotauro, and at the time no one wanted to go to the ground with Nogueira.
    He defeated fighters like Sylvia and Arlovksi. Now you hear about them and you think "pfff they are nothing special", but in 2008-2009 they both were in the Top 5 and many people thought that they would beat Fedor.

    He submitted in 50 seconds an Olympic Judo silver medallist.
    He absolutely destroyed Heath Herring, who at the time was one of the best fighters.

    Before the Werdum fight, the only time in his career where he was in deep trouble was when Fujita rocked him with that punch. Other than that, Fedor was never in serious trouble.
    He had some tough moments but he was never knocked down, or almost submitted.
    I know MMA math doesn't work and that is why I didn't bring it up. I was saying Antonio Silva was better than Fedor because he not only beat him, but made him look inferior; whether size had anything to do with it or not. I wouldn't go as far as saying he dominated the ground against Nogueira but he did do well, as well with the striking against Mirko and Hunt, but not dominating; he held his own I would say. But like I said, he was pretty well rounded for the era in MMA. And I wouldn't say JDS is one dimensional. Just because Cain can take him down at will, doesn't mean anything. I'm sure Cain can take anyone he wants down at will. I think if you check the stats, JDS wasn't taken down at all before his matches with Cain.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pasha K View Post
    I agree that fighters today are way more complete than 10 years ago, but I am pretty sure that Fedor would be very competitive against fighters of today.
    Or you seriously think that he can not beat Frank Mir or Josh Barnett or Roy Nelson?
    No I think he can beat Mir and Nelson no doubt. I think he could beat Barnett by KO by catching him. If he doesn't catch him with a shot, I could see Barnett smothering him with his size. But again, these fighters are pretty much from the old era barely hanging on.

  2. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by braddahmatt View Post
    And I wouldn't say JDS is one dimensional. Just because Cain can take him down at will, doesn't mean anything. I'm sure Cain can take anyone he wants down at will. I think if you check the stats, JDS wasn't taken down at all before his matches with Cain.
    I don't think JDS is one dimensional either, but I highly doubt Cain would have been able to take down a prime Crocop. Just sayin'.

  3. #73
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    i just randomly watched this, its kinda on topic if anyone is interested..
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIPPsU7g8TY

  4. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Joker View Post
    I don't think JDS is one dimensional either, but I highly doubt Cain would have been able to take down a prime Crocop. Just sayin'.
    Just saying Cain took down a two time NCAA Champion and made it look easy.
    Gotta resolve the Gayness


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    I would like to add that Brock took Cain down rather easily himself, but got WAY too excited and tried to transition from full guard to full mount lol.

    Fedor has some awkward throws and if he found himself on the bottom has/had some of the best hips in MMA history.

  6. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sakara=Excitement View Post
    I would like to add that Brock took Cain down rather easily himself, but got WAY too excited and tried to transition from full guard to full mount lol.

    Fedor has some awkward throws and if he found himself on the bottom has/had some of the best hips in MMA history.
    Except, unfortunately, against Giant Silva.

  7. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiny Neustra View Post
    Just saying Cain took down a two time NCAA Champion and made it look easy.
    You must be referring to Brock, who also took down Cain in under 30 seconds and made it look easy, although in Cain's defense, he was able to get up rather quickly. Compare that to Cain’s takedown of Brock which didn’t come until 2 minutes into the fight, after he already looked visibly tired.

    As for Crocop, he faced wrestlers like Ron Waterman, Kevin Randleman, Mark Coleman, Josh Barnett, and Olympic Judoka Hidehiko Yoshida and made it look easy as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by hass View Post
    Except, unfortunately, against Giant Silva.
    In all fairness, Fedor was probably gassed after getting smothered against the cage in the first round, but that's just part of the game under unified rules.

  8. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Joker View Post
    You must be referring to Brock, who also took down Cain in under 30 seconds and made it look easy, although in Cain's defense, he was able to get up rather quickly. Compare that to Cain’s takedown of Brock which didn’t come until 2 minutes into the fight, after he already looked visibly tired.

    As for Crocop, he faced wrestlers like Ron Waterman, Kevin Randleman, Mark Coleman, Josh Barnett, and Olympic Judoka Hidehiko Yoshida and made it look easy as well.


    In all fairness, Fedor was probably gassed after getting smothered against the cage in the first round, but that's just part of the game under unified rules.
    Ron Waterman Waterman began his career as a high school art teacher and wrestling coach eventually entering the professional MMA arena and becoming a respected veteran fighter of the UFC,

    Kevin Randleman amazing wrestling chops however 5 ft 10 in (1.78 m) 205.5 lb (93 kg; 14 st 10 lb) CroCop and Randleman only fought twice and they split 1 and 1 First figth Randleman wok via KO second fight Loss "15–10 Mirko Filipovic Submission (guillotine choke) PRIDE Shockwave 2004 December 31, 2004 1 0:42" Now is memory serves correctly that was off a takedown that Randlemen made an error on and got caught

    Mark Coleman that was a great fight but again another point I am making with Randlemen 6 ' 1 205 lbs,

    Josh Barnett not sure if this is "Easy" they fought three times in there carear first shoulder injury in the first minute second 3 rounds descion war last submission punches 7 minutes in not sure that can be "Easy" ,

    Olympic Judoka Hidehiko Yoshida 5-11 225 lbs leg kicks great fight but it wasnt easy either,

    Cain 77 inch reach, 241 pounds, Six foot one, but the big thing NCAA Div 1 champ, BJJ Black Belt, studies Maui Thai as well as Kickboxing.. During the Golden age of Pride they had an amazing HW Roster however.. This might get a lot of hate here but I will say this right now, the Pride HW Division is why UFC is what it is today because we had kids in middle school watching MMA and wanting that one day but we dont have students of one art that get decent in another, we now have students of many arts and masters at them as well. You take Any current UFC Champion and send them back in time to Prides Heyday and I say the Current fighters win 9 out of every 10.
    Gotta resolve the Gayness


  9. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiny Neustra View Post
    Ron Waterman Waterman began his career as a high school art teacher and wrestling coach eventually entering the professional MMA arena and becoming a respected veteran fighter of the UFC,

    Kevin Randleman amazing wrestling chops however 5 ft 10 in (1.78 m) 205.5 lb (93 kg; 14 st 10 lb) CroCop and Randleman only fought twice and they split 1 and 1 First figth Randleman wok via KO second fight Loss "15–10 Mirko Filipovic Submission (guillotine choke) PRIDE Shockwave 2004 December 31, 2004 1 0:42" Now is memory serves correctly that was off a takedown that Randlemen made an error on and got caught

    Mark Coleman that was a great fight but again another point I am making with Randlemen 6 ' 1 205 lbs,

    Josh Barnett not sure if this is "Easy" they fought three times in there carear first shoulder injury in the first minute second 3 rounds descion war last submission punches 7 minutes in not sure that can be "Easy" ,

    Olympic Judoka Hidehiko Yoshida 5-11 225 lbs leg kicks great fight but it wasnt easy either
    Thanks for posting all the stats, which help to highlight my point that Crocop was able to stay on his feet against a variety of wrestlers, despite himself having no wrestling background. No disrespect to Cain, but I have not witnessed any great feats from his wrestling that would lead me to believe that he would have more success than the others.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiny Neustra View Post
    Cain 77 inch reach, 241 pounds, Six foot one, but the big thing NCAA Div 1 champ, BJJ Black Belt, studies Maui Thai as well as Kickboxing..During the Golden age of Pride they had an amazing HW Roster however.. This might get a lot of hate here but I will say this right now, the Pride HW Division is why UFC is what it is today because we had kids in middle school watching MMA and wanting that one day but we dont have students of one art that get decent in another, we now have students of many arts and masters at them as well.
    Several fighters have been quoted as being inspired by the greats of Pride. No denying that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiny Neustra View Post
    You take Any current UFC Champion and send them back in time to Prides Heyday and I say the Current fighters win 9 out of every 10.
    Many people would agree with you, the majority of MMA fans I might say. Unfortunately I don't share your belief, and to the contrary, I would say just the opposite; if you were to take any UFC champion and put them up against Pride fighters in their prime (in a ring under Pride rules of course), I believe the UFC fighters would lose 9/10 times. But that's just my opinion.
    It's times like this that I wish Zuffa resurrected Pride, or entered their fighters into a JMMA promotion just to see how well they would do, against both former Pride fighters (who are older now) and against other Zuffa fighters. That would answer a ton of questions IMO, but that will likely never happen. A man can dream though.

  10. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Joker View Post
    Thanks for posting all the stats, which help to highlight my point that Crocop was able to stay on his feet against a variety of wrestlers, despite himself having no wrestling background. No disrespect to Cain, but I have not witnessed any great feats from his wrestling that would lead me to believe that he would have more success than the others.


    Several fighters have been quoted as being inspired by the greats of Pride. No denying that.


    Many people would agree with you, the majority of MMA fans I might say. Unfortunately I don't share your belief, and to the contrary, I would say just the opposite; if you were to take any UFC champion and put them up against Pride fighters in their prime (in a ring under Pride rules of course), I believe the UFC fighters would lose 9/10 times. But that's just my opinion.
    It's times like this that I wish Zuffa resurrected Pride, or entered their fighters into a JMMA promotion just to see how well they would do, against both former Pride fighters (who are older now) and against other Zuffa fighters. That would answer a ton of questions IMO, but that will likely never happen. A man can dream though.
    You missed my big points, first most of the wrestlers besides Barnett, and Waterman don't have the size that Cain had, smaller lighter wrestlers, Coleman and Randlemen gave Cro Cop Problems, I see Cain countering those gaps in CroCops game and pushing him around and dominating the fight, and I fail to see how you could take more rounded fighters who are better right now and put them against more secular fighters who werent as well rounded and expect them to win. You make an interesting point that I very much disagree with, now you have fighters who are disciplined in a wide area of skills, its one of the things that made Fedor so good was that he truly was great in several areas, but I say this now, both Cain and Jones I believe would of beaten a Prime Fedor, assuming a Prime Fedor is able to cut to 205..
    Gotta resolve the Gayness


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