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[bigsemi]

Kimbo is horrible.

Roy is the best fighter on the show, and he'll probably never crack the top 10 in the UFC.

I remember seeing some crap about how Big Marcus was going to be this huge stud and pose a threat to Brock.

I think it is safe to say that none of these guys would even pose much of a threat to Kongo, let alone, Brock, Nog, Carwin, Cain, or Santos.

Hopefully a couple of the younger guys will develop over the next couple years, but the side show that is Kimbo is pretty much done. He'll get smashed by just about any decent heavy weight inthe UFC. I mean if Roy did that to him, imagine what Brock would do to Kimbo. It would be a big, brown greasy spot with a beard. I might even feel bad for te guy.

[Tfunk241]

I'm going to put something out there and I am sure I will get responses of I am a "conspiracy theorist", which I can understand. What I hope people who read this get out of it is that I am a MMA fan who is just a little suspicious of the result, not the Nelson win, but how he did it as well as the over production of TUF 10 as a whole.

The production "value" has moved to a "MTV Real World" level. This show has done more for MMA than anyone who was involved in the sport prior to it's inception could have ever imagined, but the set scenes and product placement have become nauseating. I won't go as far as to say that the fights are fixed or rehearsed, however I really find it hard to believe that the "pitter patt" shots to the top of Kimbo Slice's dome that were being doled out by Roy Nelson were the best Roy had to offer. The fights may not be fixed or rehearsed but if you don't believe that Dana White and the production crew don't have "creative suggestions" for certain fighters in certain fights I've got some swamp land in Arizona I'd like to sell you. I find it very hard to believe that a BJJ Black Belt under Renzo Gracie could get himself into such a dominate position and only offer pot shots to the top of Kimbo's head as a way to finish his opponent.

The problem is most of the fans who view The Ultimate Fighter are "casual" fans who know enough about the sport to sound like they know what is going on but in reality only have a faint clue. So today we have posts saying "Kimbo was robbed", or "Herb Dean is an idiot for stopping the fight". In "reality" what most likely happened is that Roy Nelson was lobbied not to inflict too much damage to the "Golden Goose" in finishing him, because those in the know realize that it wasn't if he would finish Kimbo, but how he would finish him. They even went as far as to show some footage of the fighters discussing the fight and Nelson "predicting/foreshawdowing" exactly what he was going to do to win. I'd really like to believe that this isn't the case, however I have seen Roy Nelson and Kimbo fight in the past and Roy Nelson is leagues ahead of Kimbo and looked like he was giving a "half-ass" effort.

Ultimately what we saw last night unfortunately was what seemed to be the creative "genius" of Dana White and the UFC. They kept their "Golden Goose" relatively healthy and "creatively" kept him in the thick of things with the foreshadowing of an "unfortunate illness" for Marcus Jones and the possibility of Kimbo being his replacement. MMA is a great sport, and TUF is a groundbreaking show, let's hope it doesn't become any more "scripted" than what we've seen so far this season.

[deadstealth]

No one has pointed out that Nelson hit kimbo 44, thats FORTY FOUR CONSECUTIVE UNANSWERED BLOWS....in what fight, ever, in any mma, kickboxing, muay thai, or boxing match, has EVER not been stopped after that?? Thats 44 consecutive unanswered blows AFTER nelson got the crucifix the 2nd time, not total unanswered blows of the 1st round. He totally destroyed kimbo on the ground, could not have possibly dominated him more in terms of position. Herb Dean is a fucking cheat, but nelson made sure that didnt matter.

In the process, nelson showed how to use a big belly as a weapon. He turned a seemingly huge disadvantage into a weapon and huge advantage in the ring. That is so smart and resourceful, given roy's body type, and im amazed people dont praise roy for that. That is 100% exactly what roy needed to do to win the fight, he could not have executed a better gameplan. I guess people think hes supposed to go out there with his chin in a rickson position for kimbo, otherwise hes a pussy.......

And about his attitude, so what? This is fighting, personality is not required. Your approval is not needed.

[lordpyro]

Originally Posted by DarkMage

Not sure what you are talking about there. Clay "Sideshow Bob" Guida, regardless of whether he wins or loses, is always fun to watch because he's always moving and ridiculously active on the ground with an endless supply of stamina.

If your definition of "laying on top of someone" is constantly going back and forth between who is in the dominant position, as well as acting like a wild man in his fights.....then yes....Sideshow Bob lays on people.

I can't say I disagree with your assessment of Guida. He is very active and can hold a guy down and maintain dominant position.

I just don't care for it. I would rather see a stand up war or a good jits game. Some of his fights are great to watch. I though he was awesome v. Diego. I just find that alot of his fights are boring because he is so completely dominant but, not doing much with it. If he was pounding guys out or submitting them, I'd feel different.

However, I don't think the blame nessecarily lies with Guida. I think most of his opponenets cannot rise to the level nessecary to challenge him.

[Malice]

Originally Posted by deadstealth

No one has pointed out that Nelson hit kimbo 44, thats FORTY FOUR CONSECUTIVE UNANSWERED BLOWS....in what fight, ever, in any mma, kickboxing, muay thai, or boxing match, has EVER not been stopped after that?? Thats 44 consecutive unanswered blows AFTER nelson got the crucifix the 2nd time, not total unanswered blows of the 1st round. He totally destroyed kimbo on the ground, could not have possibly dominated him more in terms of position. Herb Dean is a fucking cheat, but nelson made sure that didnt matter.

In the process, nelson showed how to use a big belly as a weapon. He turned a seemingly huge disadvantage into a weapon and huge advantage in the ring. That is so smart and resourceful, given roy's body type, and im amazed people dont praise roy for that. That is 100% exactly what roy needed to do to win the fight, he could not have executed a better gameplan. I guess people think hes supposed to go out there with his chin in a rickson position for kimbo, otherwise hes a pussy.......

And about his attitude, so what? This is fighting, personality is not required. Your approval is not needed.

My thoughts exactly.

I know 1 other fight where even more blows landed and was not stopped....Kimbo vs James Thompson.

[lordpyro]

Originally Posted by Rockx

How did he lay n pray? He got mount....Crucified him.... beat his ass....that's not LnP.

geez folks! this is craziness.

First, I never used the term Lay and Pray. you threw that in.

How is a crucifix not laying on top of someone? Thats the purpose of the position. Yes, he dominated Kimbo and got him in a bad position. Kimbo looked like a chump as expected. But, tell me that Nelson couldn't have done more with the position?

There was a fight (can't remember v. who) where Gary Goodridge put someone in a crucifix and beat their ass unmericfully. That is what Nelson should have been doing.

[Malice]

Originally Posted by lordpyro

How is a crucifix not laying on top of someone? Thats the purpose of the position. Yes, he dominated Kimbo and got him in a bad position. Kimbo looked like a chump as expected. But, tell me that Nelson couldn't have done more with the position?

There was a fight (can't remember v. who) where Gary Goodridge put someone in a crucifix and beat their ass unmericfully. That is what Nelson should have been doing.

Crucifix + punches = domination hold and work, not LnP. Lay N pray is staying on top in the guard or half mount (or mount I guess) just laying there making no progress.

He was throwing punches and they were landing squarely on his face...

Look at the Matt Hughes vs BJ 2...this is exactly how Matt stopped the fight.

[pa99ortiz]

Originally Posted by Rockx

Roy Mounted him, crucified him and was giving him short fists in the head in Round 1, he obviously was trying to maintain control and didn't want to draw his arm back too far and get off balanced.

I think Dana is upset that his meal ticket got his face stamped in the opening round.

Roy did exactly what any MMA fighter with a brain would have done...take little damage on the feet, get Kimbo to the ground where he laid like a fish.

Yea no kidding, I wonder how the ratings will do now?

[braddahmatt]

Originally Posted by Rockx

crucifix + punches = domination hold and work, not LnP. Lay N pray is staying on top in the gaurd or half mount just laying there making no progress.

He was throwing punches and they were landing squarely on his face...

Look at the Matt Hughes vs BJ 2...this is exactly how Matt stopped the fight.

more like the top of the head than the face... kimbo's face was busy being suffocated by fatness.

[lordpyro]

Originally Posted by Rockx

crucifix + punches = domination hold, not LnP. Lay N pray is staying on top in the gaurd or half mount just laying there making no progress.

He was throwing punches and they were landing squarely on his face...

Look at the Matt Hughes vs BJ 2...this is exactly how Matt stopped the fight.

He was throwing punches yes.

Look, I could careless who the fighter is. If he can't be bothered to try and win by throwing good punches then I'm gonna bitch. PERIOD.

Check this vid, about a 23 seconds in they show what you should be doing with a crucifix.

YouTube - Gary Goodridge HL by Damien - TheMMAForums.com